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Crack just forward of the tabernacle UPDATE w/pix

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delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Initially Posted - 06/21/2013 : 11:04:44

Last weekend before we went out, I wanted to switch out the QR pin holding the forestay to a regular pin, especially after the thread on having the mast fall.

This was a bit more work than I expected, but I used a handy-billy to pull down on the jib halyard to take the load, and backed off the turnbuckles for the fore & aft stays. I did not loosen the shrouds as I didn't think it'd be necessary. As it turns out, this was probably a bad idea. While we were cranking down on the handy-billy, I heard a CRACK! but thought it was just the shrouds complaining as that's roughly where the sound came from. I didn't think anything of it until I stepped up on the cabin and saw a roughly 9-10" crack running athwart-ships about a foot in front of the tabernacle. Crap. We weren't planning on sailing to Blake Island anyway, so I wasn't too concerned about the crack structurally. I know the core is roughly 4" thick in that area (possibly a bit more, this is where the little hump the mast stands on is).

I think this is just a crack in the gelcoat, but I have no way of knowing that yet, as I haven't ground it down at all to look. I'm expecting to be able to fill it with white Marine-Tex, fair & sand & call it good. If it's more structural, I guess I'm going to be learning more about fiberglassing than I currently know.

Anyone experienced anything similar, or have thoughts regarding possible damage I've done to the boat? I don't have any pictures, meant to take them when we got back and forgot, so I'll be looking at it tomorrow if it's not still pissing down rain like it has been for the past few days. If nothing else, I want to get some Gorilla tape or something to prevent further water intrusion.

David
C-250 Mainsheet Editor

Sirius Lepak
1997 C-250 WK TR #271 --Seattle area Port Captain --

Edited by - delliottg on 06/23/2013 14:05:49

TakeFive
Master Marine Consultant

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2272 Posts

Response Posted - 06/21/2013 : 12:29:53

I suggest that you take a few minutes to unscrew one or both of the spots over your dinette table and look up onto the void with a flashlight. I think that there's quite a bit of void space under there. I'm not sure, but I think that the solid core that you refer to is only a limited area around the mast itself. But check for yourself - it does not take long. I had those lights out to check for leaks a couple years ago while I was rebedding the mast light socket.

If it is hollow like I think it is, you might be able to visually verify whether the crack goes through or is just surface gelcoat. I agree that it's very likely to be the latter.

I am having a hard time understanding what would have stressed your fiberglass, since the shroud chainplates are connected to the hull via those tie rods that go through the cabin. Is it possible that the tie rods have worked loose, allowing the chainplates to pull up and flex the cabin top?

Edited by - on

britinusa
Web Editor

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USA
5404 Posts

Response Posted - 06/21/2013 : 13:42:16

David, forgive the confused here... (me) Did you release the BackStay? I can imagine a load applied to the front of the mast converting to a significant downward force on the cabin top if the backstay were taught.

Paul

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delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 06/21/2013 : 20:03:27

Rick, I plan to take a look tomorrow. I think the spot lights might be too far back, but like you said, it only takes a minute to remove them. I know that the plate under the mast is around 4", and this is only about a foot in front of that. I'm going to bring my Dremel with me and grind down a bit unless I can get a thin tool in there to probe around (doubtful).

Paul, I'm a bit fuzzy on the sequence of events now, I know that I loosened the back stay, but I'm not sure when. I know it wasn't before I started (which it should have been), and I actually think it might have been after the "pop" we heard, but I'm no longer sure. If that's the case, it's my own damn fault & hopefully it's cosmetic, and not structural.

I remember thinking I should be able to just take the load off of the forestay to swap out the pin, but I couldn't get it loose, even with Rita's help which is when I started backing off the turnbuckles. The handy-billy is a six part fall, so lots of potential advantage.

Edited by - on

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 06/23/2013 : 14:05:24

Here are some pictures of the damage and repair:

The crack:

After a bunch of grinding, basically I used a ball bit on my Dremel to follow the crack through the gel coat and down into the underlying fiberglass, and then a cone stone to smooth it out and feather it back. Eventually the crack petered out, either on it's own (toward the right), or when I hit core (sort of center & left). There was no visible damage to the core, so I stopped when I hit it:

A little ding on the bow that's been there since we bought the boat, figured I might as well grind it out too & repair it:

Taped off ready to fill. The lesson I learned here is lay down the tape from the outside in, so when you pull up the outside, the inner stuff comes with it so you don't have to pick at the tape with wet Marine Tex everywhere (and it'll get everywhere, you'll sense a theme), and you almost can't have too much width to the tape. I only used two widths, five wouldn't have been too many. Marine Tex gets everywhere when you're using it. Also, I should have placed the tape closer to the crack so there'll be less to sand when it comes time:

Here's what it looked like after application, setting, and smoothing with a wet finger (surprisingly effective). I couldn't take any pictures during the process, but Rita did, which I'll post later. I didn't want to Marine Tex my phone, it gets everywhere!

The ding at the bow after the same process:

And finally the thing that started this whole process:

Top Tip: If you want to clean your rub rail, acetone is your friend! Like new with just a wipe or two.

Edited by - delliottg on 06/23/2013 14:07:43

Russ.Johnson
Commodore

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USA
855 Posts

Response Posted - 06/26/2013 : 10:53:13

David,

Looking at your pictures, does that section of the deck have a balsa wood core?

Russ

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delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 06/26/2013 : 14:43:58

It looked more like plywood to me than balsa. Also when I sealed my compression post many moons ago, it was definitely plywood.

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daz
Deckhand

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New Zealand
7 Posts

Response Posted - 07/12/2013 : 10:53:58

your repair should keep moisture out in the short term
the long term fix will be to use epoxy or polyester mixed with an additive like micro balloons
that will help with the strength you want and is more permanent
the hard part is matching the gel coat

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TakeFive
Master Marine Consultant

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2272 Posts

Response Posted - 07/12/2013 : 12:27:05

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by daz
 ...the long term fix will be to use epoxy or polyester mixed with an additive like micro balloons...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
But isn't that just what Marine-Tex is? It's a filled epoxy.

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delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 07/12/2013 : 18:06:55

From their website : <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"> Marine-Tex is a heavy-duty structural epoxy, used to repair aluminum, fiberglass and wooden boats, reinstall loose or stripped fasteners, permanently bond dissimilar metals without galvanic corrosion, and fill gouges in wood, metal and fiberglass, making repaired areas stronger than before. <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I have no plans to make a more permanent repair, this is the repair unless shown to be deficient. I do plan to apply another skim coat to bring the surface level with the surrounding gel coat. Since I had no idea what I was doing, it didn't come out as well as planned.

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