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Flags and Burgees

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Kirk McKay
Navigator

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USA
111 Posts

Initially Posted - 02/06/2003 : 16:43:08

Ok, I'm begging for help on this important subject! With all this time on my hands(winter), I was wondering what other people have done to rig up a line to fly flags and burgees? I see that WM & BUS sell kits to atach to spreaders and backstays, is that the way to go or is there some other trick? Of course this will allow me to proudly fly the 25/250 burgee (as soon as I get off my but and send for one!) I picked up a copuple of cool ones while I was down in the BVI's in Jan. and might fly some of them as well. I suppose there are rules as to how to do that as well?

Kirk

Edited by - on

John G-
Admiral

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793 Posts

Response Posted - 02/06/2003 : 17:12:09

Kirk,
All you need is a padeye and a small swivel block riveted to the middle of your starboard spreader. If you don’t want to rivet the spreader you could just zip tie a block to the spreader. It will show but you won’t have two holes in the spreader. Get some 1/8” line and you’re all set. You can get a small cleat to put on the stay but I just run mine down to a cleat on the mast.
The National Association burgee looks great, every member should fly one, and when you visit another state or country you can fly a courtesy flag. It will give you a place to fly your state flag and the burgee for the 4th and really dress up your boat. One thing, on a broad reach you might get a flapping noise from the flags or burgees slapping against the main on port tack.
BTW taking zip ties and putting them on your spreaders with the extra sticking straight up will keep the cormorants off the spreaders.<img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>
 

[url="http://www.peregrinefund.org/"]<img src="http://www.peregrinefund.org/images/intro_mid_image.GIF" border=0>[/url]
 John G- "PEREGRINE" C25-#4762 FK

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Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3323 Posts

Response Posted - 02/06/2003 : 17:17:33

Kirk - using my KISS principle, I bought 2 small padeyes and 2 small bullet blocks. Drilled holes in the underside of the middle of the spreaders and ran a 1/16" line on a continuous loop from the bullet block on each padeye down to the horn cleat on each side of the mast. The flags are attached to small brass "dog snaps" that have been lark knotted into the correct position on each flag halyard.
BTW it is considered bad form to fly another country's courtesy flag while in domestic waters (a pity, that. I have a few I'd enjoy showing off!). Chapman's Piloting has an excellent chapter or two on correct flag usage. It is also incorrect to fly ANY flag(s) while racing unless it is a Class ribbon or authorized by the RC.
Derek

Edited by - on

Kirk McKay
Navigator

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USA
111 Posts

Response Posted - 02/06/2003 : 19:32:39

Ok, this leads me to my next question....getting up to the spreader, any suggestions? I'm really not excited about taking the mast down at this point. Could I lash a smaller ladder to the mast...since I'm not going all the way up?

Kirk

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Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3323 Posts

Response Posted - 02/06/2003 : 19:50:36

Kirk - use a "butt bucket" aka a bosun's chair, and have someone haul you up the mast.
Derek

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John G-
Admiral

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793 Posts

Response Posted - 02/06/2003 : 19:59:57

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
Ok, this leads me to my next question....getting up to the spreader, any suggestions? I'm really not excited about taking the mast down at this point. Could I lash a smaller ladder to the mast...since I'm not going all the way up?

Kirk
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>
Kirk,
I’m not sure I would recommend a step ladder. Can you borrow a bosun’s chair and get some one to winch you up? I own a “Captain Al’s” mast ladder. It’s a web ladder that uses mainsail slugs in the mainsail track and each web “rung” has a piece of PVC to step on. I use a climber’s harness, climb up and clip in when I get there.
What ever method you use, be careful, and tie your tools on to a belt or something.
 

[url="http://www.peregrinefund.org/"]<img src="http://www.peregrinefund.org/images/intro_mid_image.GIF" border=0>[/url]
 John G- "PEREGRINE" C25-#4762 FK

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Carl B.
1st Mate

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USA
83 Posts

Response Posted - 02/06/2003 : 21:15:44

How big of a person can use a bosun's chair or “Captain Al’s” mast ladder on the C25 mast???? I'm 240lbs and trying to loose some #'s.

"OBLIVIOUS" C25 '82 #3098 SR/FK/Trad

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John G-
Admiral

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793 Posts

Response Posted - 02/06/2003 : 21:33:35

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
How big of a person can use a bosun's chair or “Captain Al’s” mast ladder on the C25 mast???? I'm 240lbs and trying to loose some #'s.

"OBLIVIOUS" C25 '82 #3098 SR/FK/Trad
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>
Carl,
How strong is the person winching you up? <img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>
The mast ladder will deal with the weight and unless you REALLY try to roll the boat over the C25 will have no problem with the weight.
Use a saftey harness with the mast ladder.
 

[url="http://www.peregrinefund.org/"]<img src="http://www.peregrinefund.org/images/intro_mid_image.GIF" border=0>[/url]
 John G- "PEREGRINE" C25-#4762 FK

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Ray Seitz
Captain

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USA
416 Posts

Response Posted - 02/06/2003 : 22:02:10

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>If you don’t want to rivet the spreader you could just zip tie a block to the spreader. <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>
I like that idea John I have been trying to figure out how to attach a swivel block to the spreader w/o holes. I hate to make any holes in the boat or spars. Thanks don't know why I didn't think of it.

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>How big of a person can use a bosun's chair or “Captain Al’s” mast ladder on the C25 mast???? I'm 240lbs and trying to loose some #'s. <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>
Carl I used a climbing belt from my old tree working days. I weigh ~185 an my half brother winched me up the mast. He is 21 years old ~6' and 200 lbs he had no trouble other than his insecent whining. The C250 has lewmar#16 self tailing winches.

I assume it is ok to fly more than one burgee at a time. Is there any order that they should be flown. ie. c25/250 assoc. above local lake burgee or it doesn't matter.

Ray Seitz C 250WB #628 Sea Major

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John G-
Admiral

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793 Posts

Response Posted - 02/06/2003 : 22:26:16

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
[
I assume it is ok to fly more than one burgee at a time. Is there any order that they should be flown. ie. c25/250 assoc. above local lake burgee or it doesn't matter.

Ray Seitz C 250WB #628 Sea Major
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>
Ray,
The C25/C250 National Association flies on top! National gets the top over local.
Of course I just made that up but hey the Association deserves the respect!! <img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>
Actually any state or country courtesy flags would be the top flag. All flags/burgees should fly on the starboard spreader.
 

[url="http://www.peregrinefund.org/"]<img src="http://www.peregrinefund.org/images/intro_mid_image.GIF" border=0>[/url]
 John G- "PEREGRINE" C25-#4762 FK

Edited by - on

ksaum
Deckhand

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USA
14 Posts

Response Posted - 02/06/2003 : 22:26:51

Kirk,
To work on the spreader or a steaming light attached to the mast just above it I've used a 20'aluminum extention ladder a number of times. With non-skid pads on its bottom feet placed on on the foward cabin top, a PFD cushion held by its handles to the top pressed against the mast - so the ladder isn't in direct contact with the mast - and a short length of rope (line?) securing the ladder to the mast its fairly stable.
Ken Saum - "Been There"

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lcharlot
Master Marine Consultant

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Antigua and Barbuda
1301 Posts

Response Posted - 02/07/2003 : 00:11:09

Zip ties are not UV resistant - the sunlight will rot them in a year or two, and they will break, dropping your flag halyard at a probably inconvienient moment. I know this from personal experience of the flag halyard on "Quiet Time". Instead of a Zip tie, attach your small block to the spreader with 4 or 5 loops of stainless steel safety wire or aluminum electrical wire, pulled tight and knotted. This will not rust, sun won't affect it, yet it is removeable and adjustable.

Larry Charlot
Catalina 25 #1205 "Quiet Time"
Sacramento, CA

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Douglas
Master Marine Consultant

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1595 Posts

Response Posted - 02/07/2003 : 00:31:41

The U.S. Ensign or U.S. flag should be flown from the stern not on the stbd spreader. National courtesy flag can fly from the stbd spreader after the Q flag has been taken down and you are cleared in.

Doug&Ruth
Triska (Alberg 29)
Tacoma Wa.

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John G-
Admiral

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793 Posts

Response Posted - 02/07/2003 : 07:25:21

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
The U.S. Ensign or U.S. flag should be flown from the stern not on the stbd spreader. National courtesy flag can fly from the stbd spreader after the Q flag has been taken down and you are cleared in.

Doug&Ruth
Triska (Alberg 29)
Tacoma Wa.
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>
Sorry, I did mean that courtesy flags and burgees should fly off the starboard spreader. The ensign should fly from the stern as Doug says.
 

[url="http://www.peregrinefund.org/"]<img src="http://www.peregrinefund.org/images/intro_mid_image.GIF" border=0>[/url]
 John G- "PEREGRINE" C25-#4762 FK

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Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 02/07/2003 : 08:47:45

Really simple for me, I bought 30 feet of some 1/64 or maybe 1/32 stayset x in a nice blue color. (about 9 bucks worth) Grabbed a cable tie from the tool box and picked up a very very very small block from westmarine (cost 2 bucks).

I sent one of the yard boys up in a bosuns chair and had him attach the block to the spreader near the shroud. Since the lines are led aft, I use the old Jib halyard cleat to tie it off.

dw

D. Wolff - "The Flying Wasp" #401 sr/sk
Chief Measurer C-25/250 National Assn.
<img src="http://www.flags.com/dreamimages/Flags/measurer.jpg" border=0>

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Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 02/07/2003 : 08:51:46

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
Zip ties are not UV resistant - the sunlight will rot them in a year or two, and they will break, dropping your flag halyard at a probably inconvienient moment. Larry Charlot
Catalina 25 #1205 "Quiet Time"
Sacramento, CA
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

Yes Larry, they are, however a nice wrap around with rigging tape should take care of that problem. Not to mention you can always replace the thing once a year.

D. Wolff - "The Flying Wasp" #401 sr/sk
Chief Measurer C-25/250 National Assn.
<img src="http://www.flags.com/dreamimages/Flags/measurer.jpg" border=0>

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Kirk McKay
Navigator

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USA
111 Posts

Response Posted - 02/09/2003 : 17:25:38

Thanks for all the opinions. Now it's just deciding how to get up there. I do have a bosuns chair from the previous owner, not sure if it will haul my largeness up there. I may wait for a smaller person to be around. Maybe I'll luck out and somebody will happen by the yard with a lift. It won't be long before we're all sailing again! (what's that, more snow in the forcast tonight?)

Kirk

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Douglas
Master Marine Consultant

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1595 Posts

Response Posted - 02/11/2003 : 00:58:15

Duane I hope you let the yard boy down once in a while for food etc. ROTFLMAO.

Doug&Ruth
Triska (Alberg 29)
Tacoma Wa.

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Ben
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1234 Posts

Response Posted - 02/12/2003 : 14:43:16

I have a question about flags and burgees, having never raced or flown a flag or burgee, is there a special meeting to a sky blue flag with a large "B" on it? I didn't know if this was a racing flag, but I found it on my boat the other day.

Thanks,

Ben
Adventurous
#5553
C25 SR/SK

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John Mason
Admiral

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USA
687 Posts

Response Posted - 02/12/2003 : 14:58:07

Ben, maybe it means the bar is open, cocktail hour.<img src=icon_smile_tongue.gif border=0 align=middle>

John Mason - Ali Paroosa
1982 - FK/SR #3290

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Ben
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1234 Posts

Response Posted - 02/12/2003 : 15:42:11

That's what I'm hoping!<img src=icon_smile_approve.gif border=0 align=middle>

Ben
Adventurous
#5553
C25 SR/SK

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Buzz Maring
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1772 Posts

Response Posted - 02/12/2003 : 16:03:48

I have a question about flags and burgees, having never raced or flown a flag or burgee, is there a special meeting to a sky blue flag with a large "B" on it? I didn't know if this was a racing flag, but I found it on my boat the other day.

Thanks,

Ben
Adventurous
#5553
C25 SR/SK


There seem to be a lot of Texas Longhorn fans at our marina ... I've seen lots of burgees with longhorns on them, and I also saw a big red "N" a few weeks ago that I assumed was for the University of Nebraska. Is there a university that starts with "B" that uses that blue color?

Buzz Maring, C-25 SK/SR #68, "Freya"
<img src="http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b3df23b3127cce9306a9b3abad0000001010" border=0>

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Carl B.
1st Mate

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USA
83 Posts

Response Posted - 02/12/2003 : 20:42:50

Ben,
" sky blue flag with a large "B""
The "B" is for Ben and sky blue is your favorite color.

"OBLIVIOUS" C25 '82 #3098 SR/FK/Trad

Edited by - on

Ben
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1234 Posts

Response Posted - 02/13/2003 : 07:25:04

Hi Carl, that's what my wife said, except the favorite color part. The blue a little too closely resembles "Carolina Blue," and having lived in Raleigh for a couple years, we're more Wolfpack fans than Tarheel fans.<img src=icon_smile_clown.gif border=0 align=middle>

Ben
Adventurous
#5553
C25 SR/SK

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