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OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3466 Posts

Response Posted - 10/22/2013 : 09:41:20

Gary - Thanks for sharing the story. Not sure what I would have done if I was in same situation. Interesting to read the other thoughts on this. At the very least, it seems a good idea to have a high powered light onboard to shine around. But faced with someone already on your dock right next to your boat - Understand the state of mind one goes through.

Larry

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 10/22/2013 : 10:16:35

My dock is guarded by two Japanese Chins belonging to a neighbor...

Any perp who climbs onto the dock is likely to be licked to death.

All this gun talk...

(Today's headline: "Nice" Kid Kills Beloved Teacher with Parents' Gun)

Edited by - on

Davy J
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1511 Posts

Response Posted - 10/22/2013 : 11:13:05

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">All this gun talk... (Today's headline: "Nice" Kid Kills Beloved Teacher with Parents' Gun)<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Unfortunately shows that gun laws will not prevent someone from killing, if they are set on it, even a 12 year old boy.

Seems to also indicate that gun free zones are very dangerous places....

Edited by - on

redeye
Master Marine Consultant

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3476 Posts

Response Posted - 10/22/2013 : 12:29:56

Well.. I'm guessing we are only a few years away from consumer cameras that will take infrared video, or a cell phone for that matter... and we can post the video.

One of my favorite beach web cams ( Schooners, Panama City Beach fla ) broadcasts the beach shot 24/7 and at night it converts over to infrared... Sweet little security setup.

Edited by - on

redviking
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1771 Posts

Response Posted - 10/22/2013 : 17:46:22

Call me stupid and brazen, but I carry no guns, just a big ass flare gun. But even so, sans the flare gun, I still would've walked up topsides.... The best defense is just a simple, "Can I help you?" Liveaboards like me, value the benefits we all provide each other... Stealthy thief take anything? Doesn't sound like it.... He was more afraid of you than you should've been of him... Thieves are cowards at best.... Seriously.... A grey haired granny could've taken him out...

Sten

Edited by - on

redviking
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1771 Posts

Response Posted - 10/22/2013 : 17:51:33

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Ask any scandahoovian how many Gus and gun deaths they have and you will find the right answer....

Sten

Edited by - on

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4304 Posts

Response Posted - 10/22/2013 : 19:11:13

One thing I forgot to mention was while I was laying there 1/2 awake I had my laptop on (I'd fallen asleep with it on earlier). The brightness was up all the way and the guy should have been able to see the light through the curtains when he pulled in to the slip next to me. Being on top of a double height air mattress puts you pretty close to the height of the windows and the laptop was facing the direction he came in from. I closed it as soon as I heard the sound of the motor.

It is interesting how many different ways we all would react. While a shotgun would be a bit harder to maneuver inside the cabin if you cut the barrel down to the minimum legal size it should make it a little easier.

Two reasons a shotgun might be better than a pistol is a) when your hands are shaking you don't have to be as as accurate to hit your target, and b) if you miss you don't have a relatively large chunk of lead traveling a mile or more in a densely populated area. Shotgun pellets would do a lot less damage, won't penetrate nearly as much, and don't travel nearly as far as a bullet.

I thought about getting some type of portable alarm/flashing light setup that uses a motion detector to activate a siren and lights if someone walked down my finger pier. I nixed that idea after I remembered there are a couple of ducks that think I'm their best friend and they'd set it off coming to see me!

I'm still wondering how the local marine patrol or CG would react if you had a pistol on-board and no hand gun license.

Another thought on the shotgun, I'm looking for a ring tone or phone app that makes "the sound". Most likely they wouldn't stay around long enough to see if it was a gun or not!

Edited by - GaryB on 10/22/2013 19:16:19

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 10/22/2013 : 19:47:22

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by redviking
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Davy J
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">All this gun talk... (Today's headline: "Nice" Kid Kills Beloved Teacher with Parents' Gun)<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Unfortunately shows that gun laws will not prevent someone from killing, if they are set on it, even a 12 year old boy.

Seems to also indicate that gun free zones are very dangerous places....

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Ask any scandahoovian how many Gus and gun deaths they have and you will find the right answer....

Sten
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Because of something personal, I can't leave this alone. If you prefer data to conjecture, take a look at [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate"]this[/url]. Use the column headers to sort it by each category, and compare the numbers. I'll let the facts speak for me. (Note: Switzerland has their own version of the 2nd Amendment, based on their approach to national defense. Compare them to their neighbors.)

Sarge out.

Edited by - on

redeye
Master Marine Consultant

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3476 Posts

Response Posted - 10/23/2013 : 07:06:30

They make a "shotgun" shell for the 38 special. very nice.

Edited by - on

Davy J
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1511 Posts

Response Posted - 10/23/2013 : 07:40:01

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Two reasons a shotgun might be better than a pistol is a) when your hands are shaking you don't have to be as as accurate to hit your target, and b) if you miss you don't have a relatively large chunk of lead traveling a mile or more in a densely populated area. Shotgun pellets would do a lot less damage, won't penetrate nearly as much, and don't travel nearly as far as a bullet.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
I won't hot link it here. But look up "Taurus Judge". Unlike a shot gun, you would be able to wear it. Although they are quite a bit larger than other concealed carry handguns.

Edited by - on

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5376 Posts

Response Posted - 10/23/2013 : 22:06:29

Dave "Stinkpotter" - the numbers are fascinating.
While Sweden, Norway, Finland, Iceland and Denmark are one tenth of Brazil, Argentina, Panama & Colombia, they are still not as low as you'd figure.
The US is in the same order of magnitude of the Latino countries.
India, Singapore, Taiwan, Korea and the UK are extremely low.
Interesting...

Edited by - on

Davy J
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1511 Posts

Response Posted - 10/24/2013 : 04:05:22

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">The US is in the same order of magnitude of the Latino countries. <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
If you were only able to remove the "data" from 6 US metro areas;
Wash DC, NJ, NYC, Detroit, Chicago, LA,
You would see the US numbers drop,..... by orders of magnitude.

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 10/24/2013 : 07:12:33

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Davy J
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">The US is in the same order of magnitude of the Latino countries. <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
If you were only able to remove the "data" from 6 US metro areas;
Wash DC, NJ, NYC, Detroit, Chicago, LA,
You would see the US numbers drop,..... by orders of magnitude.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">The other countries have cities, too (e.g. Sao Paulo, Caracas, Cali, Acapulco...). BTW, Metro Tampa has higher firearm homicide and suicide rates than metro NYC ([url="http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/pdf/wk/mm6018.pdf"]CDC figures[/url]), and FL's (#9) is higher than NY's (#28). (FBI figures)

Edited by - on

glen
Captain

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359 Posts

Response Posted - 10/24/2013 : 07:53:10

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by dlucier
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by glen
 I can see Don has never vacationed in Detroit :)
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Does working downtown count? I can see the "Joe" from my office window.

Besides being monitored around the clock by the Metropark police, my marina also hosts the DNR, county sheriff, and border patrol.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Sorry Don I guess I was looking at your Virgin Island signature (and wishing I was there) Where is your marina, our boat is on the Clinton River. We sail mostly in Anchor Bay, but try to make it to Milliken Harbor at least once a year, and walk to Greek Town for dinner. If you are sailing over in our corner of the lake next year look us up

Edited by - on

Davy J
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1511 Posts

Response Posted - 10/24/2013 : 10:45:07

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">BTW, Metro Tampa has higher firearm homicide and suicide rates than metro NYC (CDC figures),<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
As far as I can tell, the CDC report also includes justifiable homicides by civilians carrying a concealed weapon. In which they used to protect themselves from a crime. This would make some sense of those numbers because Florida has close to one million concealed carry permit holders.

NYC & NJ have almost zero civilians carrying concealed weapons. Yet, the number of homicides indicate there are a lot of weapons in that area. So why would you not want to be able to defend yourself from someone carrying a weapon illegally ?

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 10/24/2013 : 11:32:14

Glad you were not attacked or hurt. A Mossberg 500 with a pistol grip could easily be stowed on board. A pistol loaded with hollow point or frangible ammo might be a better option to deal with a confrontation. With shore power, maybe rigging up a LED deck light would be a good deterrent.

If you watch closely in the movies, a one-handed racking of the slide only takes place AFTER a shot has been fired. Otherwise, you would have to first press the slide release in order for the slide to move!

Edited by - dmpilc on 10/24/2013 11:33:45

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 10/24/2013 : 15:44:29

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Davy J
 As far as I can tell, the CDC report also includes justifiable homicides by civilians carrying a concealed weapon. In which they used to protect themselves from a crime. This would make some sense of those numbers because Florida has close to one million concealed carry permit holders. NYC & NJ have almost zero civilians carrying concealed weapons. Yet, the number of homicides indicate there are a lot of weapons in that area. So why would you not want to be able to defend yourself from someone carrying a weapon illegally ?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">I can't continue this weird logic game. I lived near and worked in NYC for 25 years, my kids and many friends live in NYC. None of us thinks about carrying weapons, or wants to. Apparently people in Tampa think about and want to carry them. Nuff said.

I'm glad Gary was safe, and hope the stains came out.

Edited by - on

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5376 Posts

Response Posted - 10/24/2013 : 16:56:40

My worry is about shooting holes in things, as well as people. A hole in a boat is like a hole in a plane - things get outta hand in a hurry: sinking or falling out of the sky. Aside from a very skilled sharpshooter I know, I'd guess that most shooters miss more often than not what they intended to hit. That means that the bullets probably hit something else.
I can only imagine a monty python-type skit in the marina where a nearsighted shooter completely misses his intended target, while sinking one boat after another.

Edited by - on

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4304 Posts

Response Posted - 10/24/2013 : 17:47:38

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Stinkpotter
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Davy J
 As far as I can tell, the CDC report also includes justifiable homicides by civilians carrying a concealed weapon. In which they used to protect themselves from a crime. This would make some sense of those numbers because Florida has close to one million concealed carry permit holders. NYC & NJ have almost zero civilians carrying concealed weapons. Yet, the number of homicides indicate there are a lot of weapons in that area. So why would you not want to be able to defend yourself from someone carrying a weapon illegally ?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">I can't continue this weird logic game. I lived near and worked in NYC for 25 years, my kids and many friends live in NYC. None of us thinks about carrying weapons, or wants to. Apparently people in Tampa think about and want to carry them. Nuff said.

I'm glad Gary was safe, and hope the stains came out.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Yeah for the most part. I'm gonna try to get some fresh ones tomorrow night!

Edited by - GaryB on 10/24/2013 17:47:59

TCurran
Admiral

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USA
588 Posts

Response Posted - 10/24/2013 : 19:05:06

Another forum I read (college football) a lot tends to lock threads that get too political...not really a bad idea. The talk about the benefits and dangers of having a gun onboard a boat is one thing, discussion on gun control/crime rate is another. It may be best to agree to disagree on that subject and go sailing...

Edited by - on

Davy J
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1511 Posts

Response Posted - 10/25/2013 : 01:33:00

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I can't continue this weird logic game.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
There is no "weird logic", you may ignore the truth if you wish. Here is the link to the CDC page on homicide circumstances, see (7-16):
http://www.cdc.gov/ncipc/pub-res/nvdrs-coding/Homicide-Circumstances.pdf

You can choose to be a victim, I will choose to defend my family.

Edited by - Davy J on 10/25/2013 01:49:49

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 10/25/2013 : 07:00:45

Carry on.

Edited by - on

pastmember
Master Marine Consultant

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2402 Posts

Response Posted - 10/25/2013 : 16:33:03

I think I found the perfect BDS (boat defense system)
Turn on the deck light and pop your head out wearing this from REI COOP It is their fault the pict is so large

Twist the eyes to look 360° around you to spot your next tasty bug meal.
See predators coming up behind you with the mirrors on either side of the mask. (Or, sneak up on others in your green disguise!)
Sturdy plastic mask has a softer plastic around the face for comfort. Elastic strap can be adjusted to fit.

Edited by - pastmember on 10/25/2013 16:36:51

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