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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Capri 25 Specific Forum

Cracks in deck

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jbuck
Deckhand

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9 Posts

Initially Posted - 12/05/2013 : 19:14:49

I am new to sailing and considering a Capri 25. There are 2 in my area that are early 80s models. I have looked at both and both of them have cracks in the deck where the aft corners of the cabin meet the deck. I have attach a photo that has the areas marked. The cracks are hairline and run port/starboard for about 1.5" to 2" each. When I saw the first one I was concerned. But when I saw the second boat with the same cracks I am wondering if this is something common to Capri 25s this age. Does anyone know if this indicates a structural problem or is it more cosmetic? It seems strange to me that both would have the same cracks on the same areas.

Thanks,

John

Edited by - on

joearcht
Navigator

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USA
241 Posts

Response Posted - 12/05/2013 : 19:37:46

My boat #433 has the same thing. They appear to me to be surface gel coat cracks and do not go all of the way threw the structure. I've not looked at any other boat to see if they are common, but I've sailed my boat hard in 25 to 30 knot winds and never been concerned about them. If the boat is going to structurally fail I believe it will be someplace else before that crack becomes a problem.

Edited by - on

shnool
Former Capri-25 Tech Editor

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USA
1032 Posts

Response Posted - 12/05/2013 : 19:45:20

I have the same ones. When I picked mine up, the owner had a massive ratcheted come-along (probably 4 inch wide) strung from the trailer over the the deck just behind the cabin...

My point is I think mine were from over zealous tightening on that strap. So trailering. If the pads on the trailer aren't adjusted right, it could also happen remember the weight should be MOSTLY on the keel (like 90%).

The deck is still VERY strong, the cracks are gelcoat alone on mine, but wide/long. I've marked them to see if they are getting longer.

What should be done, is the cracks ground out, filled and sealed. I suspect once that is done, and a less aggressive trailering setup is done, it'll hold for quite a while.

Here's a shot of mine.

Edited by - shnool on 12/05/2013 19:48:40

jmadd
1st Mate

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USA
85 Posts

Response Posted - 12/05/2013 : 19:49:12

Yeah, my observation is the quality of the factory gelcoat is not a high point of the Capri. Mine has hairline cracks in several places, chips in others and worn through nearly completely in still more places.

That being said, I've never heard of anyone having any structural problems with the deck/cabin areas though so I wouldn't worry about it. Sounds like you're giving it a pretty through going over! Don't skip a quick swim with mask and snorkel to check out the bottom, especially fore and aft of the keel to see if there are any cracks there. Those are usually not structural either but a crack can allow water incursion. Blisters can be a problem with the Capris so you want to keep thing dry as possible under the barrier coat. Read these forums and you'll get an overview of all the +'s and -'s of the Capris. Good Luck!

Edited by - on

jbuck
Deckhand

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9 Posts

Response Posted - 12/06/2013 : 02:46:53

Are you talking about cracks in the hull or in the seal between the hull and keel? Is this a common problem?

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shnool
Former Capri-25 Tech Editor

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USA
1032 Posts

Response Posted - 12/06/2013 : 05:04:30

jbuck... the "big" problems with these boats are:
Keel flex (usually due to delamination/degradation of the glassed in plywood in the sub floor - hard to see without a viewport)

Bulkhead rot (forward at the compression post, and aft at the bottom where water lays)
cracked scuppers, which leak - putting water at the aft bulkheads
chainplate leaks (usually check bulkhead, and rebed/replace)
excessively soft fordeck (which is usually the latticework of wood under it, also easy fix)
Blisters (that's merely an age/water intrusion thing with all boats 30+)
Gelcoat cracks are normal on a boat this age, trick is to fill them and seal them to keep water from intruding the weave.
Soft transom - these boats have several key wood pieces that are sandwiched between the stern and hull liner, that usually rots over time, and softens the transom
Wobbly rudder post... The FIRST thing to try is replacing the bushings... but the shaft sits within a gelcoat/fiberglass column, which dirt gets into and wears it out, so shimming can be done but my experience is using new bushings gets at least a season or 2.
Leaky windows. This is the MOST common problem. The Windows are a bear to fix the leaks. Simplest fix is to replace them with surface mount models, which is a permanent fix.

Those are the biggies.

My point is none of these things are HUGE... but CAN be if taken in total (lots of work). If the sub-floor gets REALLY weak, and the keel flexes a lot, it can create quite a problem with the keel. Most of this is more a grounding/trailering problem... but there are huge write-ups on what the problem is, where the most extreme example of that is here:
http://forums.sailinganarchy.com/index.php?showtopic=119553

Obvious signs of the above is the compression post is "sinking," or a bump directly forward of the keel below (say on a trailer).

By the way MOST of the Capris were made from 1980 to 1982, with VERY limited production runs through 1992. Anything newer than 1983ish, and the windows are surface mount like the Capri 22.

Simple fix for the window leak (if you aren't in really rough waters), is a cabin cover... then they can leak all they want, you just cover it while you aren't there.

Those cracks probably wouldn't concern me much but they'd need to be "sealed" right away... you know as long as they aren't much worse than mine.

As for the comment about the gelcoat not being real good on these... Well it's certainly thinner than some boats (probably a weight thing), but again most of these boats are 30+ yo. There is very little wood in the boat (except the sub floor), <b>there is no balsa core (nothing there to rot)</b>, which makes these boats hold up REALLY well otherwise, especially for such a light boat.

Edited by - shnool on 12/06/2013 05:13:37

jbuck
Deckhand

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9 Posts

Response Posted - 12/07/2013 : 04:22:06

Thanks to all for all the pointers. It looks like I have a few things to add to my list when I go back for a second look.

Since it is too cold for a swim under the boat, I will ask that the boat be trailered so I can get a look at the hull and keel before I make a decision. I also need to remove the plate covering the keel bolts and take a look at that.

How big a deal are blisters in the gel coat? I have heard that is a common problem.

It did have some rudder wobble but that seems to be fixable.

When you talk about bulkhead rot are you talking about the visible wooden bulkheads or something hidden on the fiberglass? The first time I looked at the boat there were some moisture stains on the wooden bulkheads but no rot was apparent. It seemed to have come from the windows. The foredeck was firm. I did look at one boat on which the foredeck was springy around the hatch. This one did not have that problem.

I know there a lot of things with the rigging I will be looking at again too but the hull is the main thing I am concerned with. I believe the boat has been in the water for a couple of years now and I don't want to buy something that is all rotten below the waterline. I didn't see anything apparent on the initial inspection but will be looking a bit closer now.

John

Edited by - on

shnool
Former Capri-25 Tech Editor

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USA
1032 Posts

Response Posted - 12/07/2013 : 06:23:42

Actually the blisters aren't a horrible problem to fix (if you already have to do a bottom job that is)...
It's pop the blisters... drain them... let them air out... sand/fair/barrier coat bottom paint.

Here's a blister in mid-repair (key is to let the weave below it dry)...

Bulkheads, yep visible ones in the quarter berths, rot happens at the bottom (where water lays).

Scuppers leak, causing the water.

Just because the boat has been in the water, doesn't mean it'll have blisters. This problem is more a reflection of age of the boat, and poor bottom jobs, than a problem with the boat design. It's a COMMON problem in 30+ yo fiberglass boats. It indicates failed bottom work, or water laying on the inside of the weave (bilge) for too long (aka sometimes years).

Keep in mind we're likely talking a sub $10k boat I am sure... some of this is "you pay your price you take your chance."

Rudder wobble can constitute dramatic drag if not fixed (again easy fix)...

Did we mention state of the sails? Huge expense to replace.

If it has a trailer, don't neglect the state of the trailer. They are BIG bucks to replace, and repairs aren't exactly cheap. Biggies are tires, bearings, and brakes. If you are moving it via trailer too, then best make sure the trailer is road worthy.

Edited by - shnool on 12/07/2013 06:31:08

abraxis
1st Mate

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USA
49 Posts

Response Posted - 12/07/2013 : 11:13:21

I too experienced many of the above concerns and addressed them with great results, especially the loose rudder post and windows. Go into the past postings in the archives and you will be pleasantly surprised to find the
answers to just about all of your concerns as OUR boats have been around for a long time and have acquired an
almost cult like following.

Edited by - on

shnool
Former Capri-25 Tech Editor

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USA
1032 Posts

Response Posted - 12/07/2013 : 11:44:28

jbuck what you aren't feeling in these questions/answers is how great the boat is to sail...
Maybe THIS will help:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tkp3Vr2rOjc
This is light wind, 8-10mph. That's a 155 dacron (not even a good quality sail, its 30yo).

Edited by - on

jbuck
Deckhand

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9 Posts

Response Posted - 12/10/2013 : 03:32:50

Where is the best place in the Capri 25 to check the bilge for standing water?

And thanks again for all the suggestions and encouragement!

Edited by - on

shnool
Former Capri-25 Tech Editor

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USA
1032 Posts

Response Posted - 12/10/2013 : 04:43:17

without an added hole drilled in the sub-floor, it's hard. I haven't put one in either. But the obvious spot to look is under the step and behind it... if it's on a trailer, jack up the dolly. If in the water, get a person or 2 to sit in the stern.

but a hole drilled in the compartment under the step (5 inch type with a port)... is a good place to add a hole, and also to install a sump.

Another good place to put one of those is just forward of the compression post (or aft).
Something like this:
http://www.catalinadirect.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=product.display&product_ID=315&ParentCat=270

Edited by - shnool on 12/10/2013 04:44:03

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