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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

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First time applying bottom paint (VC17)

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Ben
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1234 Posts

Initially Posted - 02/17/2014 : 14:01:26

Hi All,

Not a Catalina problem, but I thought I'd ask here because of the depth of experience among Catalina sailors. I've never applied bottom paint myself on any of my other boats, and I'd like to get some paint on the bottom of my new-ish Beneteau before the boat goes into the water. This will be just my second season with the B361. The previous owner put VC17 on the boat, which is fine with me, that's what I had put on my Catalina 25's bottom.

I did a Google search on how exactly to apply VC17 but couldn't find anything. I've been told it's super easy, that you have to be careful with it because it evaporates crazy fast, but other than that I don't have any good information to go on. Usually Youtube is pretty good for tutorials, but I didn't find much there either.

So can anyone give me step-by-step instructions on what to do, any paint-saving tips, any lessons learned, etc... for this noob? I'd rather not pay the yard, they want $432 in just labor to apply one coat (and I think I need 2 coats), which seems a bit expensive when you factor in the additional cost of the paint.

At the end of last season the bottom didn't look too bad, just a bit of slime.

Thanks so much for any help.

Ben
Beneteau 361
Viking Kitty
Columbus, Ohio

Edited by - on

shnool
Former Capri-25 Tech Editor

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USA
1032 Posts

Response Posted - 02/17/2014 : 18:42:24

several will tell you the ketchup bottle squeeze way is the way to go. I am not sure what that is supposed to accomplish.

My take? JUST KEEP STIRRING. The copper, sinks, so you have to keep stirring it to get it melded in. Otherwise regular paintbrush will work, brush quickly in fore-aft motion... don't criss cross your brush strokes, as it'll be quickly sticky and make a mess. The brush strokes self level. But if you WANT to roll it on you can, honestly though, the roller pads, or short nap roller would be the ONLY way I'd roll it. This stuff is too thin really to roll.

This stuff goes on STUPID thin, 2 quarts does 2 coats on my 25. Guessing you might need 2 to 3 quarts for 1 coat on a 36 footer.

Edited by - on

Ape-X
Admiral

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USA
662 Posts

Response Posted - 02/17/2014 : 18:47:02

Evaporation of the solvent carrier is the issue. Some use the ketchup bottle, while a friend a the marina gave me a better hint: Use a small sponge roller, dip directly into the can, and set the lid on between dips. I was able to put a thin coat each season on the C25 fin keel including rudder. No slime. I prepped with acetone and lightly wiped to freshen the surface.

Edited by - on

OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 02/17/2014 : 20:24:14

I invested in an Airless sprayer + the optional flexible tip. Easy and fast.

Edited by - on

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4312 Posts

Response Posted - 02/17/2014 : 21:45:54

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by OJ
 I invested in an Airless sprayer + the optional flexible tip. Easy and fast.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
This is good way to set yourself on fire if proper procedures are not followed! Under the right conditions static electricity can be generated by the sprayer and ignite.

Not sure which model sprayer you have but here's an excerpt from the Wagner Optimus Owner's manual. This applies to all airless sprayers.

2. For use with only water-based or mineral spirit-type materials with a minimum flash point of 21ºC (70º F) — Do not spray or clean with liquids having a flash point of less than 21ºC (70º F). Flash point is the temperature at which a fluid can produce enough vapor to ignite.

The Flash Point for VC 17 is:

6. FIRE AND EXPLOSION INFORMATION
Flash Point: F: 53 C: 12
Lower Explosive Limit (LEL): 2 (%vol in air) at Normal Atmospheric Temp and Pressure

Fire and Explosion Hazards:
Flammable liquid and vapor. FLAMMABLE/COMBUSTIBLE MATERIALS: Will be easily ignited by heat, sparks or flames. Vapors may form explosive mixtures with air. Vapors may travel to source of ignition and flash back. Most vapors are heavier than air. They will spread along ground and collect in low or confined areas (sewers, basements, tanks) creating a vapor explosion hazard.

Another thing to keep in mind. If you use an airless rig it has to be plugged into a 3-prong grounded outlet! If you don't, static electricity can build up almost immediately and possibly cause a fire.

Edited by - GaryB on 02/17/2014 22:22:50

dasreboot
Admiral

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804 Posts

Response Posted - 02/18/2014 : 04:53:36

$100 craftsman airless sprayer. spray spray spray. takes longer to tape the waterline than to spray the whole boat. I did one pass with a roller and thought that this stuff was a beast to work with. checked the internet to see if I can spray it. YES

Edited by - on

pastmember
Master Marine Consultant

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2402 Posts

Response Posted - 02/18/2014 : 07:38:43

I have never noticed anyone at my club doing anything but pouring the paint in a roller pan and rolling it on with small dense foam rollers, the finish is excellent and with a roller you move so fast that evaporation is not an issue. I use the small roller pan that fits the small rollers. I would guess that I pour about a sixth of the can into the pan at a time and simply shake the can before each pour. DO NOT MAKE VC 17 HARD TO DO. The entire point is ease of ownership, the speed is the gift, the ease is the reason.
When is the Defender paint sale? I need one more quart

Edited by - pastmember on 02/18/2014 07:47:53

Ben
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1234 Posts

Response Posted - 02/18/2014 : 08:18:39

Thanks guys, as usual you are the best. I don't feel nearly as intimidated about the project now. :)

Edited by - on

TakeFive
Master Marine Consultant

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2272 Posts

Response Posted - 02/18/2014 : 08:36:45

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by GaryB
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by OJ
 I invested in an Airless sprayer + the optional flexible tip. Easy and fast.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
This is good way to set yourself on fire if proper procedures are not followed! Under the right conditions static electricity can be generated by the sprayer and ignite.

Not sure which model sprayer you have but here's an excerpt from the Wagner Optimus Owner's manual. This applies to all airless sprayers.

2. For use with only water-based or mineral spirit-type materials with a minimum flash point of 21ºC (70º F) — Do not spray or clean with liquids having a flash point of less than 21ºC (70º F). Flash point is the temperature at which a fluid can produce enough vapor to ignite.

The Flash Point for VC 17 is:

6. FIRE AND EXPLOSION INFORMATION
Flash Point: F: 53 C: 12
Lower Explosive Limit (LEL): 2 (%vol in air) at Normal Atmospheric Temp and Pressure

Fire and Explosion Hazards:
Flammable liquid and vapor. FLAMMABLE/COMBUSTIBLE MATERIALS: Will be easily ignited by heat, sparks or flames. Vapors may form explosive mixtures with air. Vapors may travel to source of ignition and flash back. Most vapors are heavier than air. They will spread along ground and collect in low or confined areas (sewers, basements, tanks) creating a vapor explosion hazard.

Another thing to keep in mind. If you use an airless rig it has to be plugged into a 3-prong grounded outlet! If you don't, static electricity can build up almost immediately and possibly cause a fire.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Please heed Gary's warning. This is a serious issue. The motion of the non-conductive paint across plastic sprayer parts will generate static, and the resulting spark could engulf you in flames. Maybe you got away with it last time because the humidity was high. Next time, your number could be up.

This is the kind of stuff that causes boatyards to ban DIY work.

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 02/18/2014 : 11:08:22

Been using VC-17 for quite a long time now, and as Frank mentioned, I use the small 4" foam roller to apply. Since evaporation is the enemy, it dries silly fast, the least amount exposed to the air, the better off you'll be. I open the can, pour in the copper, put the lid back on securely, then shake well. Using an awl, I then poke two holes on opposites sides of the lid for pouring directly onto the roller. I only pour enough to wet the foam roller then roll it in the pan to spread it around the roller. Paint is never left in the roller pan as while you are applying the paint to the hull, the solvent in the pan is quickly evaporating. Every so often, I'll grab the top of the can and swirl it around to keep it mixed.

Using this technique, I can single coat the entire hull, double/triple coat the rudder, and doube/triple coat within 12" of the waterline, and all leading edges. If there is paint remaining, I'll double coat the fin keel. All of this is done with one can of paint.

Edited by - on

dasreboot
Admiral

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804 Posts

Response Posted - 02/20/2014 : 05:42:02

is defender the best place to buy. i need one more quart this year as well.

Edited by - on

sdpinaz
Navigator

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USA
193 Posts

Response Posted - 02/20/2014 : 07:09:45

http://www.usaboatstore.com/interlux-vc-17m.htm?feed=Froogle

this is the cheapest I could find right now. Neverbought anything from them, they are in Pensacola...

Edited by - on

pastmember
Master Marine Consultant

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2402 Posts

Response Posted - 02/20/2014 : 07:59:50

Defender prices are always "in there" and I have complete confidence in them. When you add shipping Defender is cheaper than USA BOATSTORE.

Shipping Address

Frank Hopper
3849 N. Clarence
Wichita, KS 67204

Qty Ordered Item Description Each Total
1 752830VC7ORI Interlux VC 17m Extra Antifouling Paint $56.99 $56.99
SubTotal $56.99
Total Shipping Weight 2.00 Lbs.
UPS Ground Residential Shipping $10.60
Tax $0.00

Total
$67.59

Edited by - pastmember on 02/20/2014 08:12:25

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

USA
5908 Posts

Response Posted - 02/20/2014 : 08:17:37

It looks like USA Boat Store has the best price (unless their shipping charges are excessive), but their website doesn't appear to have a rebate form for the current $5.00 per quart manufacturer's rebate that Interlux is offering. You can download the rebate form from the Interlux website at this link. It looks like the rebate is good wherever you buy the paint. http://www.yachtpaint.com/usa/diy/media-center/spring-2014-mail-in-rebate.aspx

Edited by - Steve Milby on 02/20/2014 08:19:22

shnool
Former Capri-25 Tech Editor

Members Avatar

USA
1032 Posts

Response Posted - 02/20/2014 : 08:37:54

I used to paint commercially (houses/bridges/etc)... I must paint faster than you folks. Never had it dry out to the edge while painting it... but then again, I can lay down a coat in about 30 minutes. Sure it's dry by the time I start down the opposite side, but there's no lap marks either.

Defender might not always be the cheapest, but BOY do they SHIP fast. Since I am in PA, and they are in CT, I usually get UPS ground stuff, next day. Plus they have always been super to deal with. They'll get my money in the future, and already have gotten a lot of it, in the past.

PS: I am probably going to lay on another coat myself. I have 4 on the boat now in 2 colors. I'll wait though until closer to splash time.

Edited by - on

dasreboot
Admiral

Members Avatar

804 Posts

Response Posted - 02/20/2014 : 12:44:32

these guys appear cheaper with free shipping
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Interlux-VC-17M-Extra-Antifouling-Paint-Quarts-/390534588782?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&var=&hash=item5aedace96e

Edited by - on

OJ
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 02/20/2014 : 19:34:09

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by GaryB
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by OJ
 I invested in an Airless sprayer + the optional flexible tip. Easy and fast.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
This is good way to set yourself on fire if proper procedures are not followed! Under the right conditions static electricity can be generated by the sprayer and ignite.

Not sure which model sprayer you have but here's an excerpt from the Wagner Optimus Owner's manual. This applies to all airless sprayers.

2. For use with only water-based or mineral spirit-type materials with a minimum flash point of 21ºC (70º F) — Do not spray or clean with liquids having a flash point of less than 21ºC (70º F). Flash point is the temperature at which a fluid can produce enough vapor to ignite.

The Flash Point for VC 17 is:

6. FIRE AND EXPLOSION INFORMATION
Flash Point: F: 53 C: 12
Lower Explosive Limit (LEL): 2 (%vol in air) at Normal Atmospheric Temp and Pressure

Fire and Explosion Hazards:
Flammable liquid and vapor. FLAMMABLE/COMBUSTIBLE MATERIALS: Will be easily ignited by heat, sparks or flames. Vapors may form explosive mixtures with air. Vapors may travel to source of ignition and flash back. Most vapors are heavier than air. They will spread along ground and collect in low or confined areas (sewers, basements, tanks) creating a vapor explosion hazard.

Another thing to keep in mind. If you use an airless rig it has to be plugged into a 3-prong grounded outlet! If you don't, static electricity can build up almost immediately and possibly cause a fire.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

This was years ago and apparently I forgot the flammability issue. Thanks for raising it! Certainly makes applying the product a snap.

Edited by - OJ on 02/20/2014 19:36:32

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