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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

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Sail material

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justinkonecny
1st Mate

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USA
33 Posts

Initially Posted - 05/28/2014 : 09:47:28

I have to replace my mainsail and was curious about the Warp Drive dacron. It's not much more than the traditional material when purchasing a new sail, and there seems to be good reviews of it online. Anyone using it now?

Blog of my first boat: http://justinkonecny.wordpress.com

Edited by - on

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3466 Posts

Response Posted - 05/29/2014 : 04:04:57

I used to really get into the discussions regarding sail cloth mainly because many just buy a sail from a sailmaker based on price and no real understanding of what they really are buying....It is all about the sailcloth. Dacron is not a one type product. It comes in many different weaves and then there is the coatings that are put onto it to provide addl but temporary stretch resistance. many may feel that a heavier weight sail has got to better than a lighter weight sail but some sailmakers use a lower quality Dacron weave with a heavy dose of filler/coating matl and thus have a heaver sail but not one that would hold up substantially to stretch. Almost all Dacron sails will last and last....some out there probably have Dacron sails pushing 20 years old but they probably lost their shape many moons ago. Laminants are very expensive and are very stretch resistant but they do not necessarily last that long and so the wear factor and the stretch play a role when they are replaced. Dacron sails, on the other hand, last and last based on being extremely resistant to wear but they can stretch in a very short time dependent on what weave/construction dacron sailcoth you have bought.

Warp drive is a Challenge sailcloth. Rcmd go to the Challenge website for addl info - http://challengesailcloth.com/ .
Challenge indicates that Warp drive is similar to High Aspect sailcloth. It also indicates that Warp Drive does not have the UV resistance of some of the other sail cloths but if you utilize a Sunbrella cover, then that should not be a problem. I did not have the time or interest to completely search out the Warp Drive info on the Challenge website. If they have the stretch factos as they do for the other sailcloth they sell, then you can make a direct comparison as to it's ability to resist stretching. One reason I bought High Aspect sailcloth was that it is more resistant to stretch than the 2 lower grades of Challenge sailcloth which many sailmakers utilize to maintain competitive pricing. Challenge "Performance" sailcloth is misleading in it's name since that is the least expensive Challenge sailcloth and way more prone to stretching than say the next grade - "High Modulus". Then comes "High Aspect" and finally the cadillac of the group - "Marbleweave".
A low cost Dacron sailcoth may stretch in as little as 2-4 years whereas a higher grade, tighter weave dacron sailcloth also uses low stretch stitching and may not show signs of significant stretch for 5-6 years or possibly longer depending on frequency and type of weather use.

Dacron sails will show signs of being blown out much sooner than they show significant signs of wearing.....again, many keep Dacron sails on their boats for way past 10+ years....maybe even 20 years or so.....but those sails will not maintain a real close tack to the wind if stretched out. many may not care if a sail cannot maintain a close tack to the wind and then there is the money factor.

Rcmd check out for the other Challenge matls on Challenge Mfrs website for their stretch factors and then see if they have made a chart yet for the new Warp Drive matl so you can compare to Challenge's other matls.

Edited by - OLarryR on 05/29/2014 04:05:28

awetmore
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1144 Posts

Response Posted - 05/29/2014 : 06:22:38

Laminates don't have to be very expensive. I just got a new cruising laminate main for my Pearson 28-2. It was the same price as a high end Dacron (Marblehead or the high aspect equivalent), and about 25% more than a cheaper Dacron.

http://www.china-sail-factory.com/Docs/CSFBook/adjust05-Custom%20Axis%20Laminate%20Sails.pdf

Those sails are available from many lofts (including Ullman, China Sail Factory makes the Ullman sails).

Edited by - on

shnool
Former Capri-25 Tech Editor

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USA
1032 Posts

Response Posted - 05/29/2014 : 06:57:19

I am not stumping for them, nor do I have any other interest other than to remind folks about a huge discount because of being a member here...
www.epsails.com offers a huge discount on sails based on volume sold. I've be extremely happy with the sails I've purchased from them, and have found them to be very open to what you are attempting to do, and will help you work through not only what you want, but also what you'll be happy with for your particular use.

I strongly recommend you have a conversation with them about types of sail material, what is possible, what to expect and how YOU will use a sail. I am sure they can work with you to help you make an informed decision.

Edited by - shnool on 05/29/2014 06:59:56

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5902 Posts

Response Posted - 05/29/2014 : 07:50:45

I agree that dacron sailcloth often loses it's shape after 10 or so years, but that isn't universally true. Sails made of top quality dacron can and do hold excellent shape for 20-25 years. If you intend to keep the boat for a long time, such as, "until you retire," it is well worth it to spend a little more to buy top quality sails. You will enjoy them every year that you own them.

Edited by - on

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4304 Posts

Response Posted - 06/01/2014 : 08:19:58

The quality of sail cloth obviously has a lot to do with how long sails will last. A lot also depends on the wind speeds and water conditions you sail in, and more importantly how often you use your sails.

Take two identical boats with identical sails:
One is sailed on big bays, sounds, or in the ocean with 3' - 4' waves and in 12 - 15 knot winds on a regular basis.
The other is sailed on inland lakes with ripples to - 2' waves and 6 - 9 knot winds.

All other things being equal, over the same time period the sails used on the inland boat are going to last longer than the sails on the other boat sailed in big winds and water.

Can the inland boater get by with sails that are one step down and cost less than the sails used on the other boat? I'm betting they can.

Another reason to deal with a sail-maker that is familiar with the local conditions and can recommend (after discussing your type of sailing) what will work best for you.

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9080 Posts

Response Posted - 06/01/2014 : 09:16:29

http://news.mesailing.com/msp/2009/04/sailcloth-comparisons-how-we-see-it.html

Some interesting observations about stretch--apparently tighter weaves aren't necessarily better...

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 06/01/2014 09:22:01

justinkonecny
1st Mate

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USA
33 Posts

Response Posted - 06/03/2014 : 10:25:16

I ended up going with the Warp Drive. A guy in my marina has it and said he loves it.

Edited by - on

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