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How about organizing a Association National Meetin

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wmeinert@kconline.com
Past Commodore

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USA
353 Posts

Initially Posted - 10/28/2003 : 08:55:35

If it is our intentions to develope a stronger association, would it be possible to organize a national meeting or a series of meetings? We good do a tag a long plan with the strictly sail boat show series to help bring more members into the fold. If we simply organize a hotel/bar on a Saturday of the boat show for a Association meeting time, we could maybe snag a few more interest fleet members and perhaps come up with some sort of agenda!

Or maybe rent a spot with in the show to help rase funds and sign people up. We could do this by asking the local Catalina Dealers for their help.

Bill

Bill Meinert
Commodore
Sailing Longwind #1408

Edited by - on

svmoxie
Past Commodore

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USA
331 Posts

Response Posted - 10/28/2003 : 10:32:16

Hi Bill

The National Regatta should combine with a meeting, although this did not happen last year. Your suggestion for a presence at a sail venue like the Srictly Sail shows is a good idea.

Edited by - on

Arlyn Stewart
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2980 Posts

Response Posted - 10/28/2003 : 13:16:33

Bill, at one time... there was a business meeting conducted during the Nationals. That mandatory meeting was deleted a few years ago by the Association in preference for carrying on National Association business via the Telltales newsletter. The reason, so that all memberships would be appraised/involved. In fact, official meetings of the membership require advanced publication in the Mainsheet or Telltales. This does not mean however that brainstorming can't and shouldn't take place, but simply that the arena for official business is not a small gathering of the membership.

At the risk of sounding indifferent to racing... which I'm really not... it was an important part of my life for five years... I'd like to suggest that the National Association isn't so much what appears to me to be unhealthy. In my opinion, the National Association is more the communications medium than the facilitator of special interest areas of the membership. This, for several reasons. 1. The association is made up of a diverse group, spread both geographically and of interest area. To facilitate would be to provide for a small segment of both of these. 2. The association has limited financial resources. Dues are $20, half of which goes to subscribe the Mainsheet and the other half for web site fees, postage and overhead of membership renewal service.

However, fleets are local and usually focus on racing though they could focus on any thing they wanted to. They are free to do as they wish to promote a special interest area without concern for the broader national membership. They can expend funds on special interest areas such as racing and not have it become devisive to the general membership. They can get together locally and vote and plan and do whatever without affecting the National Association. It is the fleets that have had a health issue.

Racing interest just about destroyed this association by looking to it for financial support when in reality, its best and only capability is to provide the communications medium to support the local fleets in their communications with others.

Cruiser, day sailors, family sailors and those who just enjoy fooling around with their boat... don't ask for or expect financial or other kinds of support from the association beyond communications... racing interest shouldn't either. They should make it happen within the confines of their interest and geographical areas... ie, the fleets. Please don't pull the association back into the struggle it narrowly survived.

While the unfortunate disruption caused by our last Commodore selling his boat may have delayed the announcement of next years Nationals,the officers are not responsible for fleet activity. They are responsible to the varied interest of a National Association and have been doing a heck of a good job of maintaining the prime association activity... communications. The web site continually gets good marks. John G. has/is doing a great job with Mainsheet. Finding fresh meat to beat is not the task of the officers or this association, nor is finding new cruising waters.

From the constitution, we can note the purpose of the Association is to promote... I'm all for that... but I'm also for letting special interest deal with their own areas as the abilities of the Association to facilitate are far too limiting and probematic. Let the Association do what it does best, providing comunications on an international scale... local groups can then do what they do best... make it happen where the hull meets the water.

II. OBJECTIVES:

A. The purpose of the Catalina 25/250 National Association shall be to promote the enjoyment of sailing, cruising and racing by establishing and maintaining design standards and specifications in order to ensure competition between boats of identical design and performance in all essential areas such as hull lines, weights and sail plan.

B. Promoting design class racing under uniform rules and regulations which will test the skills of the skipper and crew.

C. Promoting a program of family cruising and social activities so that members may enjoy the good fellowship associated with sailing a Catalina 25/250 sloop.

D. Keeping the cost of acquisition and up-keep of the Catalina 25/250 sloop within modest limits, without sacrificing high standards of performance and seaworthiness.

E. Cooperating with other yachting organizations and, in turn to assist on the observance and compliance with the rules and regulations of the Catalina 25/250 National Association.

Edited by - on

osmepneo
Past Commodore

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USA
1420 Posts

Response Posted - 10/28/2003 : 14:18:27

Arlyn makes some very good points. And his thoughts, in my mind, certainly supports the development of strong fleets. That's where the membership will find value and will be connected to the National Association.

The key is developing the local fleets!

And, as Arlyn points out the local fleets can then do whatever programming they want to meet the wants and needs of their members. One of the roles I see for the National Association is to help form and stregthen local fleets.

In looking through the Cat25/250 By-laws, I saw nothing about fleet formation expressed in them. That's interesting! I think it says that the primary emphasis is on the local c25/250 sailors who want to affiliate together to promote c25/250's in their area. Our National Officers may have policy, but I could find nothing in the By-laws.

So if a group of people have come together and formed a fleet want to host a regatta, they can do it, without the blessings of the National Association. If the same group want to cruise together, or rondevue (sp), they can do it. If a group of people, a fleet or not, want get together to discuss issues that are common to them, they can do it.

Then the National Association, this web site, Mainsheet and Telltales provide vehicles for promoting your activities. As the local fleets promote themselves, others in their area will see notices, and want to become part of the local fleets.

So, I guess I'm back to the local fleet

 Go Local Fleets

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5909 Posts

Response Posted - 10/28/2003 : 15:42:57

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Cruiser, day sailors, family sailors and those who just enjoy fooling around with their boat... don't ask for or expect financial or other kinds of support from the association beyond communications... racing interest shouldn't either.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

In the five national regattas that I have attended, I have never known the racers to rely on the national association for financial support. The national regattas that I attended were always regarded as self-supporting. Racers paid a fee to participate, and they and their crews also paid for their own meals. Sponsoring clubs donated the use of their own facilities and the time and labors of their members, and they rounded up donations from businesses. Often, members prepared and brought food for lunches and dinners at their own expense. The national regatta can be presented very inexpensively, and I know of no reason why it should be otherwise. If, in the past, significant amounts of national association money has been used to support the national regatta, that was a mistake, and should not have happened.

I would like the treasurer to review past expenditures to see how much of the national association's resources have actually been spent on the national regatta, and then to report the findings on this forum. If an inordinate amount of funds have been used for the regatta, then it should stop. If that has not happened, then people should stop claiming that the racers are plundering the national association's treasury, because such claims are untrue and divisive.

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"> Racing interest just about destroyed this association by looking to it for financial support when in reality, its best and only capability is to provide the communications medium to support the local fleets in their communications with others.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I am unaware of the events to which this refers, but my guess is that, if anything "...just about destroyed this association," it was petty bickering, and not racing. We only pay $20.00 a year to the national association. Half of it goes for the magazine. Part of it supports this website. For crying out loud, let's not quibble about how the other few dollars is spent. The organization ought to promote a national regatta and a national rendevous every year, so nobody will feel left out. As far as I'm concerned, the national association is welcome to divvy up any of my dues left over after its expenses, and spend it all on those two functions. I lose that much small change under the sofa cushions every year.

I can't imagine why the activities of the national association should be limited to "providing the communications medium to support the local fleets in their communications with others." If that is true, we truly are in trouble, because not many of our once long and active list of fleets are still active. The fleet at my lake, which was one of the largest and most active for many years, has disappeared. It's too bad, because they planned a full schedule of racing, family picnics and fleet cruises for many years. Non-existent or inactive fleets don't have much to talk about.

Generally, all you can do on our boats is race, cruise and daysail. It is a legitimate function of the national association to promote an annual national regatta and an annual fleet cruise. Often, when the venue of the national regatta is appropriate to the purpose, the national regatta is combined with a group cruise.

Edited by - on

Arlyn Stewart
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2980 Posts

Response Posted - 10/28/2003 : 18:28:22

I agree that once the bills are paid from a $20 dollar membership fee... then there won't be enough left over to quibble about. The problem was that not many years back, officers raised the dues to $35 which was almost double and $15 dollars more than Catalina allows for the first year membership. When investigating why the need, it was discovered that officers expenses were being paid to attend the National Reggata.

The membership balked at this... and when expressing their displeasure found their post censored and the only way they could vote was to attend the national regatta. Mark Melchoir acted quickly and established a new forum which turned the association forum into a ghost forum. Ultimately this put pressure on the incoming Commodore and led to the first membership wide vote for officers and a vote to rescind the imposed dues increase, as well as a vote to end the policy of paying expenses for officers to the Nationals.

The constitution was amended to eliminate the election of officers at the National Regatta and the mandatory annual business meeting that was represented by racers only. At the time, attendees to the regatta were the only members allowed a vote or be elected to office.

Its not my desire to infer that very many racers have such an agenda... I don't believe that. I just don't want to see history repeated. Am I probably hypersensitive about this? Absolutely!

btw... the founder of this forum, Jeff Pierce was the web manager at the time and resigned in protest of the censorship, which was being conducted by the officers not the web manager. Jeff was an avid racer and he and his dad owned a bristol C25... those who have noted the super electrical panel of " Not Yet" will be perhaps interested to know that was Jeff's boat. Also, the black shimmering opening screen to the association was his work. He was/is a class act.

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5909 Posts

Response Posted - 10/28/2003 : 20:09:26

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">The problem was that not many years back, officers raised the dues to $35 which was almost double and $15 dollars more than Catalina allows for the first year membership. When investigating why the need, it was discovered that officers expenses were being paid to attend the National Reggata. <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Arlyn, the above facts don’t support your claim that “…Racing interest just about destroyed this association by looking to it for financial support.” You haven’t shown that the money was being used for racing. It was being used by the officers for their own travel expenses. It was only coincidental that the officers went racing. If those officers had been cruisers, they could just as readily have used the club’s money to go on a sailing rendevous. If they had spent the club’s money to go cruising, would you now be claiming that “…Cruising interest just about destroyed this association by looking to it for financial support.” Blaming the greed of a particular group of officers on racing is not only irrational, but it is also unfair to the sport and to those of us who race and who pay our own expenses.

I stand by my assertion that non-racers don’t have to worry about their dues being squandered on the national regatta. The expense to the national association is nominal. In my year as Commodore, the national regatta cost the association nothing, and I believe it has always been self-supporting, or very nearly so.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 10/28/2003 : 21:57:19

Another perspective... It doesn't matter to us. We have no trailer, no yacht club we can afford to join in order to arrange to host Nationals, don't race anyway, and belong to the Long Island Sound Catalina Association (www.saillisca.com), which has more events than we have time for. The turnout for the last several national events suggests that we're not alone. This association provides an extremely valuable communication vehicle--one that can spawn local groups where people and boats can actually get together. Expecting this association to get any significant portion of its nationwide (and even international) membership and boats together at one time and place is wildly unrealistic, regardless of who pays for it or where it is. (We probably couldn't get our boat to a rendevous in Eastern Connecticut or the south shore of Long Island.) But the assocation can and does provide a conduit to communicate local events, groups, and interests.

BTW, LISCA often has a presence at sailboat shows in the area (Newport and New Jersey), but LISCA is for all Catalina models, giving it much more of a critical mass of potential members in the area. By comparison, I suspect a C-25/250 booth at the Newport show would be a lonely place to be.

Edited by - Dave Bristle on 10/28/2003 22:09:52

Arlyn Stewart
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2980 Posts

Response Posted - 10/28/2003 : 22:17:23

Steve, I've tried the best I know how to have labeled it a special interest issue.... look back at my post, I said, "In my opinion, the National Association is more the communications medium than the facilitator of special interest areas of the membership." I have no desire to cast a shadow on racing or any other special interest group.

Bill raised an issue, to plan a National Association meeting of which one of the purposes was to raise funds. My remarks were to suggest that this be a fleet activity rather than a National Association one, and to lay the ground work for the reason, I elaborated.

In that incidence... it was racing interest that caused the problem. There is nothing incidental about several officers over several years time span locking out general membership voting privileges so that they could perpetuate racing power and have the cost of doing it paid by the association. You are right however, it could have been cruising interest who captured power and leveraged it.... it wasn't however.

Does this mean a racer today ought to be an apologist... No Way!

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