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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Catalina 25 Specific Forum

c-25 rudder

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slickster11111
Deckhand

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3 Posts

Initially Posted - 08/04/2004 : 06:41:21

My rudder has split aft side and I'm thinking of the new "Balanced" as a replacement. Anyone had any experience w/the "old" vs. "new?"

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lcharlot
Master Marine Consultant

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Antigua and Barbuda
1301 Posts

Response Posted - 08/04/2004 : 08:02:35

The new balanced rudder requires somewhat less strength to steer the boat in heavy conditions, and the very latest version is manufactured in one piece with no seams, so it may be less likely to absorb water and swell up. They're awfully expensive though - about $450.

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Jonathan Cuff
Navigator

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Cayman Island
173 Posts

Response Posted - 08/04/2004 : 09:54:41

Hi

One of the first things I did on my C25 was to change the rudder to a new balanced one from CD. I found the original helm very heavy particularly over longer distances, and opted to make the change. I'm very glad I did. The new rudder is almost like having a new boat- it's easier for everyone to helm and also has a much better feel.

Cheers JC

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Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 08/04/2004 : 10:55:20

I drove one several weeks ago and the difference is remarkable. It made our heavy boats feel light and nimble. If you need a new rudder it is a no brainer. If you don't need one and already own the other toys you want it would be great. Some would say the downside is you will nor feel the rig balance because the rudder will mask it. There is probably some truth in that.

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jwilliams
Captain

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USA
357 Posts

Response Posted - 08/04/2004 : 13:44:04

The new balanced rudder from CD corrected for the frequent heavy feel and weather helm Hey Jude had.

Jim Williams
Hey Jude C25fk 2958
SF Bay

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PZell
Admiral

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USA
548 Posts

Response Posted - 08/04/2004 : 14:03:34

I was going to get a new rudder till they raised the price. Instead I learned how to better tune my rig and use the traveller and adjustable back stay to change the weather helm. From what I've read here there is a loss of that 'feel' that tells you when to adjust the traveller.
Sparky's helm is not tiring, however there is a slight lee helm in very light winds.

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oldsalt
Admiral

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USA
578 Posts

Response Posted - 08/04/2004 : 17:25:52

After sailing for many years with the original production rudder I can tell you without reservation that the balanced model is an incredible improvement. You'll think you're sailing a new, totally improved, boat since it greatly reduces the force on the tiller of weather helm and therefore, fatigue on long sails, particularly in heavy weather. Under conditions which used to result in arm fatigue with the old style rudder, I'm now easily able to steer with my fingertips. I've owned mine for four seasons and I couldn't recommend it more highly.

If you decide to order one from CD, I suggest you order it with the pintles already installed, and you'll need to give them the year your boat was built, since there are some differences in fit between certain model years.

The balanced rudder is one of the best upgrades available for the Catalina 25 and well worth the expense.

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SteveMcHugh
Deckhand

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USA
12 Posts

Response Posted - 08/04/2004 : 18:56:52

There is a drawing of a "Balanced Rudder" on the Tech Tips. I was considering building this out of plywood with a fiberglass covering. Has anyone built this rudder and if so dose it compare with the CD one for $450?

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Jack Heaston
1st Mate

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48 Posts

Response Posted - 08/04/2004 : 19:43:36

The balanced rudder from CD had a $50 freight charge to nearby eastern Oregon and another $60 for crating. Both applied, even if I picked it up at their store in Sacramento, where they had no crating or freight costs, plus I had the pleasure of CA sales tax, which would not apply if they shipped it to me.
Anyway, I bored out the split on the 83 rudder's leading edge with a Dremel tool, ran a bead of thickened West System epoxy into the groove, overdrilled the egged out pintle and tiller holes, filled with the same mixture and then drilled out the new holes.
I have not noticed a lot of weather helm on this boat, but I adjust the traveller and then the mainsheet if it heels past 20 degrees.
A word of caution on drilling the holes for the pintle brackets. Gettin them to line up exactly is a real challenge. I drilled with an 1/8" bit first and then "adjusted" the hole with increasing size bits, in three steps, before doing the final 1/4" hole.
I did install the HD bushed gudgeons from CD and they make a nice tight fit on the pintles. Another caution. On my boat, both gudgeons were attached to the transom via a glassed in bar with machine screws. All I needed was a Phillips screwdriver to remove and reinstall them. You might try this before sawing an access hole in the transom.
Good luck.
Jack 83 FK/SR 3944

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oldsalt
Admiral

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USA
578 Posts

Response Posted - 08/04/2004 : 22:03:48

The balanced rudder doesn't eliminate or even lessen any weather helm. It decreases the effect that the forces of any given amount of weather helm exert against the tiller.

Being balanced, a significant amount of those forces are distributed more evenly because they're brought forward of the axis of the pintles and work with you, rather than work against you, since they're not almost entirely leveraged behind the pintles as with the original design.

With the balanced rudder, you have to be aware of the actual amount of weather helm and keep an eye out as to when you are over canvassed and need to reef, since the softer feel of the tiller won't always tell you until you've become accustomed to the new setup.

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eric.werkowitz
Captain

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USA
283 Posts

Response Posted - 08/05/2004 : 09:36:25

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by SteveMcHugh
 There is a drawing of a "Balanced Rudder" on the Tech Tips. I was considering building this out of plywood with a fiberglass covering. Has anyone built this rudder and if so dose it compare with the CD one for $450?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Steve,

I built one about 4 years ago. It does greatly reduce the effort required to fight excessive weather helm. I used two pieces of 5/8 exterior A/C ply glued together with a covering of two layers of unidirectional and two layers of 6 oz biaxial fiberglass. I made a few changes to the basic design. For one, I installed a stainless bolt at the top to act as a rest for the tiller. On the normal rudder this load is taken by that notch at the top. I noticed this was one of the areas where the fiberglass had cracked on my first rudder.

I went to a lot of trouble trying to get a true NACA foil profile (0009). This probably isn't necessary. You can use a belt sander/grinder to get a rough approximation. This is a good off season project. It will take some time to do it well.

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The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.