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Solid wood heater

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KenO
Deckhand

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17 Posts

Initially Posted - 12/12/2004 : 23:13:03

Is anyone using a solid wood heater (Dickinson Newport) in a pop top Catalina 25? Seems to have enough room on the starboard bulkhead, and there is enough room outside the pop top area for the flue and cap, but I do not know how to deal with the vinyl cover. Sailmaker suggested using non flammable fabric to replace the standard vinyl where the flue would pass through, and adding appropriate flue length to be above the cover. I want to use the heater both with the top up and down, easily solved (?) by having a short and longer piece of flue.
Ideas

KenO

Edited by - on

Dave Laux
Captain

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318 Posts

Response Posted - 12/13/2004 : 07:32:11

Ken,
we have a Dickinson heater in our Catalina 25. It works very well and the flu is brought out to the left and slightly behind the mast as I think you are planning. We only use ours with pop top closed and the flu temperatures are such that I think it would be difficult to operate it through the pop top cover. Also the heat loss through the pop top cover will sort of negate the effects of the heater.
We burn charcoal and particularly like the natural non-bricqetted charcoal that we get in Canada. Three or four lumps of charcoal and a small stick of wood or two will run the heater for half-hour to an hour and keeps the boat comfortably warm.
Also the bits of ash flying around would stain the pop top cover which they don't do to the fiberglass. Dave

Edited by - on

ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

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3072 Posts

Response Posted - 12/13/2004 : 09:41:42

I don't have one, but there's another C-25 in the marina that does... It is mounted it on the Starboard bulkhead just as you're proposing. Seems to fit into the cabin quite well and IMHO adds to the ambiance of the space.

Edited by - on

Todd Frye
Navigator

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USA
222 Posts

Response Posted - 12/13/2004 : 15:49:14

When my sailing season ends (late August-September) the mountain lakes can see temps in the 20's. Even though we've got the down comforter, and I'm thinking this is as good as it gets...the Admiral is commenting on how cold it is. Since I just converted the galley stove to propane, I ruled out a wood burner for climate control ...yet another fuel source to deal with (O.B. gas, oil lamp, back up butane stove, etc). The propane heater we got last Christmas is great. I like the safety feature of low oxygen shut down. It fits nicely out of the way, between companion way stairs and starboard settee. Avoided putting another hole in the boat too. Propane for cooking, heating and lighting.Todd Frye

http://www.campmor.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?memberId=12500226&productId=35309042

Edited by - on

KenO
Deckhand

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17 Posts

Response Posted - 12/13/2004 : 23:54:22

Todd

I considered a free standing Propane heater (in fact I have one), but was concerned about the condensation from the water vapor associated with propane, and the potential of having propane in the cabin with out a proper solonoid and sniffer. Do you see increased condensation from your stove on the hull and cabin top? I do want to keep the crew warm and happy, but not wet.
Also to the other responders: Thanks for the info on the cover and the effect of sparks.

Ken

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Dave Laux
Captain

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318 Posts

Response Posted - 12/14/2004 : 07:40:25

Heaters of any kind, especially those that there are unvented, represent a hazard for CO poisoning. You might want to consider this before installing a propane heater that is unvented. And oxygen depletion sensor would not be the same as a CO sensor. I also think that to use propane to heat the boat you will need a larger fuel capacity than with a small cylinders. I put a 20 pound horizontal cylinder in place of the fuel tank in the cockpit locker on our boat. Dave

Edited by - on

allencl
Navigator

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USA
143 Posts

Response Posted - 12/14/2004 : 09:13:34

Dave if you can please post a pic sometime of your heater installation.

Thanks,

Edited by - on

ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

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3072 Posts

Response Posted - 12/14/2004 : 09:53:15

The reason for the Oxygen sensor... In the presense of plenty of Oxygen, propane burns cleanly and produces virtually no carbon monoxide. If the available Oxygen drops below a certain level, the flame will begin to produce CO... the sensor is there to shut the heater down before that happens (hence the indoor usage rating).

All that said, having a CO detector on a boat is a WONDERFUL idea. Not only will it provide an layer of safety against CO poisoning, it can also detect smoulding combustion before it can get out of hand (or produces CO poisoning).

Having a CO detector saved my house (and maybe my family) by detecting a smouldering towel left too close to an electric heater long before any smoke detectors went off. Best $35 I'd ever spent. I encourage everyone to get one... no, make that two. One for the boat, one for the house. IMHO makes a great Xmas present to your family.

I have one of the little 'Heat Buddy' propane heaters... it warms the cabin up very quickly, but the runtime on the attached cylinder is only about 6 hours. This makes it unsuitable for leaving on all night, but it works great for warming up the boat on a cold morning.

Most of these heaters can be attached to a hose... leading to a bigger tank. Be aware that there's a host of safety issues that need to be addressed when you put significant quantities of propane on a boat.

Edited by - on

stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 12/14/2004 : 22:11:16

We have a coleman tent heater - its a catalytic heater that runs on a small propane bottle which gives us about 10 hours of burn time. Coleman claims it is safe for indoor use. We've only used it twice, both times with good results.
This Xmas we are going to spend 2-3 weeks on the boat- we're moored in Victoria....so we're counting on the catalytic heater - which detector we should use? Coleman makes no suggestions or offers no warnings. Because of the longevity and success of Coleman, I have a fair amount of trust that they would warm consumers to potential dangers.

Edited by - on

KenO
Deckhand

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17 Posts

Response Posted - 12/14/2004 : 23:07:57

No one has mentioned the anount of condensation from the propane. We had a lot in an RV in the past from an unvented propane heater. Clambeach: What do you mean by the term IMHO, you have mentioned it twice in this forum? Victoria at the holiday, sounds great. I will be doing the sunshine coast in Oct.

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ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

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3072 Posts

Response Posted - 12/14/2004 : 23:13:25

IMHO - Web shorthand for 'In my humble opinion'...
i.e. a statement based on such.

Other common web shorthand...

AFAIK - As far as I know
IANAL - I am not a lawyer ... (usually followed by 'but')
ROFL - Rolling on floor laughing

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 12/14/2004 : 23:27:14

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by stampeder
 We have a coleman tent heater - its a catalytic heater that runs on a small propane bottle which gives us about 10 hours of burn time. Coleman claims it is safe for indoor use. We've only used it twice, both times with good results.
This Xmas we are going to spend 2-3 weeks on the boat- we're moored in Victoria....so we're counting on the catalytic heater - which detector we should use? Coleman makes no suggestions or offers no warnings. Because of the longevity and success of Coleman, I have a fair amount of trust that they would warm consumers to potential dangers.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Coleman is a Wichita Company, I used to work in their heating design lab. Do not assume anything. Take precautions.

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ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

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3072 Posts

Response Posted - 12/15/2004 : 10:12:09

Here's a link to a quick read that just might save your life or the life of someone you love.

http://www.carbon-monoxide-poisoning.com/symptoms.html

Everyone should be familiar with CO poisioning symptoms. (Note that one of the effects of moderate CO poisoning is the inability to think clearly and react to the threat).

The site also offers a link to purchase detectors. The listings will give you an sample of what's out on the market. I have no purchase experience with these folks so this is not an endorsment to buy there (looks like the specialize in bulk sales anyway). CO detectors are commonly available in most hardware stores, home and RV centers etc.

Flat out IMHO... A CO detector may be the best $35 you'll ever spend. I would not use an unvented propane heater indoors without automatic low-oxygen shutoff and a CO detector onboard.

Edited by - on

Todd Frye
Navigator

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USA
222 Posts

Response Posted - 12/15/2004 : 16:52:06

KenO,
Sorry for not getting back sooner. Just found an old Army buddy I've been trying to locate for years. Anyhow, my propane heater really doesn't produce noticeable condensation that I'm aware of. I am located in Utah (desert) and our low relative humidity would be proportional to the amount of condensation you can squeeze out of the air. I also do not run the heater at night. I can't think of anything better than a down comforter to keep you warm through the night. We use a "fleece" for a bottom sheet and dive under the comforter when the sun goes down. Maybe watch a DVD on the lap top or listen to C.D.s. I'm the early riser, so I'll light the heater and start breakfast on the galley stove. I'd say it's "safe" for the admiral to get up 15 minutes after I light the fires. Boiling water will put plenty of condensation on the interior. I get more condensation from cooking than heating. I have a colander full of "Ice Melt" that draws moister out of the air… that helps a little bit. I think you just need to evaluate your circumstances and then the choice is pretty easy. Best wishes for a warm holiday season. Todd Frye

Edited by - on

stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 12/15/2004 : 23:07:48

Thanx Frank - I'll get me an early warning system.
I thought that a company that could build a device that fills a cotton-ash bag with glowing gas could come up with a propane heater that would keep me warm and not snuff me out.

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stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 12/15/2004 : 23:14:54

Hey KenO....where you at?

I hope to do the Sunshine coast next April or May. We were over there last year in April and did some Kayaking.

Now that I have a whole hour of C25 sailing under my belt, I'm ready for some adventure sailing!

Edited by - on

Douglas
Master Marine Consultant

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1595 Posts

Response Posted - 12/16/2004 : 01:53:29

This is the heater I used in my Catalina. Its propane powered and can use cylenders or a big bottle moiunted remote with a longer feed line. It puts out more than enough heat, is very radiant and will burn 6 or 7 hours on one cylender (small). It has auto ignition, tilt sensor shut off and two temp settings. High Low and whatever you want inbetween. It has a monting pad on its back for bulhead mount or can rest on the floor or table. No mater what you run be sure to get plenty of ventalation. $85 at GI Joes

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Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 12/16/2004 : 09:56:47

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by stampeder
 Thanx Frank - I'll get me an early warning system.
I thought that a company that could build a device that fills a cotton-ash bag with glowing gas could come up with a propane heater that would keep me warm and not snuff me out.

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Thats radio-active cotton ash bag! Coleman, the best-known U.S. manufacturer, phased out thorium gas mantles in the early 90s. (Today its mantles are made with nonradioactive yttrium.) The factory workers arguably had a lot more to worry about. Thorium's radioactivity is mostly emitted as alpha particles, which only travel a couple centimeters in air and can be stopped by a sheet of ordinary paper. A study conducted at Oak Ridge National Laboratory in 1981 concluded that using a Coleman-type lantern with thorium mantles every other weekend for a year would expose you to 0.3 to 0.6 millirems of radioactivity, far less than the normal background radiation of a few hundred millirems per year. You don't want to carry thorium mantles in your pocket, though, or inhale or ingest the dust from a burnt mantle--with thorium atoms parked in your lungs or liver, your exposure would shoot up to 200 millirems per year (and stay there--remember that half-life).

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stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 12/17/2004 : 00:55:36

Okay, no coleman catalytic heater, no coleman double mantle lantern...I guess I'll have to count on the Admiral to keep me warm. Hope she doesn't wear her campaign medals on her flannel jammies.

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Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 12/17/2004 : 11:13:35

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by stampeder
 Okay, no coleman catalytic heater, no coleman double mantle lantern...I guess I'll have to count on the Admiral to keep me warm. Hope she doesn't wear her campaign medals on her flannel jammies.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

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Todd Frye
Navigator

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USA
222 Posts

Response Posted - 12/23/2004 : 12:15:13

KenO,
This article just showed up on my e-mail. Interesting reading, but maybe just more fuel to add to the fire. Todd Frye

http://www.setsail.com/s_logs/deridder/dragon15.html

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