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c25 storm sailing!

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JimB517
Past Commodore

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USA
3285 Posts

Initially Posted - 12/31/2004 : 20:37:09

Spent the night so I could get an early start this morning and try to beat the storm. At 7 AM it was grey, overcast, with light southeast winds. Runnning downwind out of the Mission Bay channel was an unusual experience. They were calling a small craft advisory ln the radio and forecasting winds over 20 by early afternoon.

Out of the harbor and around the red bouy, there was much more wind plus rough seas throwing white foam over the foredeck. Time for a reef! The new reefing hooks were set on the flattening reef. I jumped on deck and moved them, pulled in the first reef easily. Very nice to have the option of setting all 3 reefs.

I dodged the lobster bouys and decided, enough of this! So gybed in big waves and headed back. Now of course I was beating and had to pinch hard in order to avoid throwing in a tack just before the north jetty. I was flying the 135.

It was really fun surfing the big waves back into the harbor. The boat was heeling to about 30 but going over to 45 or so when a big south swell hit. They were not coming in square to the channel so it was quite a handful controlling the boat.

I decided when I was back in calmer waters that it was so much fun I had to do it again! So I gybed around and headed back out. The winds were really building. This time I really wished for a smaller headsail. I rolled up the 135 to about a 90 and the boat was nicely balanced. I saw my friend Ken and another guy motoring a Pearson 31 out. Ken shouted they were delivering it to Oceanside (25 miles downwind). I wished them "Good Luck!" in these conditions even 25 miles downwind was going to be a handful.

Ran about a mile out with them, the seas were 4 to 6 and short, steep, I was taking lots of spray over the bow even though I was on a reach.

Tacking back in was fun, again I was able to pinch around the north jetty and let the boat run back in at about 40 degrees of heel and 5.5 knots (1st reef and 90% jib). The Catalina 25 SR is a lot tougher boat than you may think. Never felt extraordinary weather helm.

So I decided I didn't have enough so I'd sail around inside. Tacking to go through the free anchorage, I got a REALLY big gust. The boat was way over and wanted to round up real bad. So I let it and then rolled up the jib all the way. Still I was making 5 knots under reefed main and heeled to 40. When the gust let up I decided to start the motor and go in (I had been at it about 2 hours. There were even white caps inside the harbor).

Motoring back to the slip, the boat was heeled at 15 degrees under bare pole!

Put her away without problems and battened down the hatches. By this time it was raining.

Great last day of the year on the water!

PS.

Stuart and Trish the couple who own the Whaler with the twin yamaha 225s had a disaster. There shore power AC apparantly started a fire. There boat is a total loss. It looks like the ashes in my firepit. Its still floating on a mooring out infront of the Mission Bay police docks but theres nothing left. The pristine Parker in the slip next to it was midly damaged by the fire. Their radome is melted, outriggers burned, rubrail melted, canvas burned. Flames were reported 30 feet high. We were lucky their gas tanks did not explode.

Indiscipline 1978 FK SR #398

Edited by - on

Oscar
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2030 Posts

Response Posted - 12/31/2004 : 20:58:04

You are having waaay too much fun....

Good workout!

Oscar
C42 # 76 "Lady Kay" (Ex. C250 WB #618 )
Georgetown MD/Fort Lauderdale FL

Edited by - on

JimB517
Past Commodore

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USA
3285 Posts

Response Posted - 01/01/2005 : 00:00:45

Yes, I am home stiff and sore. It stopped raining in time for a good soak in the hot tub!

New Years Resolution: 200 days sailing in 05

Edited by - on

gnorgan
Admiral

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USA
563 Posts

Response Posted - 01/01/2005 : 01:16:38

Day number one: January 1. 199 more days to go for you, 99 more for my goal. I can do that.....

Edited by - on

ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

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3072 Posts

Response Posted - 01/01/2005 : 10:54:43

Sounds like you're practicing for the Vendee Globe. First C25 to circumnavigate solo?

One of these little puppies might be useful and entertaining... (Skywatch Elite Anemometer)
http://www.landfallnavigation.com/-nswe1.html

Only time I've seen 15 degrees of heel under bare poles it was gusting into the upper 40's. Things can get pretty busy when singlehanding in those kinds of winds... especially when you're close to the 'hard pointy stuff'.

Edited by - on

JimB517
Past Commodore

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USA
3285 Posts

Response Posted - 01/01/2005 : 11:23:55

Single handing the boat in the big stuff is great experience and can be fun once you have some trust in your self and equipment. I needed the storm jib and its finally sorted out and should arrive soon. I also needed the motor to start RIGHT NOW when I was rounding up in the free anchorage (lots of boats and a shallow sand bar to worry about). The Honda 8 HP started on the first pull. The new reefing system worked great. My autopilot could not handle the circumstances.

Yesterday was just about on the edge of what I can handle without being overwhelmed. I use a carabiner to clip the jib sheet to the sail so I can easily change headsails. When the boat rounded up this clipped itself onto the forward lower stay leaving the jib backwinded at the worst time. This I gotta fix. Still it was only a minor annoyance at the time.

It was fun because I was not 25 miles out trying to get home before a storm and because I trust the rigging, sails and motor and have an anchor always ready. I was wearing foulies and a lifevest/harness. A C25 is really easy to handle and I could very well have been beyond my abilities in a bigger boat.

Don't forget that I spent 10 years+ as a obsessed surfer travelling the West Coast to take on the big waves in all conditions, and surfed every day after work even in the 1 foot stuff as well.

If I'm going to sail this summer to San Miguel Island and around the world some day (bigger boat) I sure better be able to handle a C25 in 20 knots and 4 to 6 foot seas (and have fun doing it).

Edited by - on

ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

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3072 Posts

Response Posted - 01/01/2005 : 12:09:43

"I use a carabiner... When the boat rounded up this clipped itself onto the forward lower stay leaving the jib backwinded at the worst time. This I gotta fix."

Take a look at 'screw-lock' carabiners...

I'm currently using a chain 'quick link'. (A chain link that opens with a gate you unscrew to open)

Have been looking around for a better, non-fouling quick-change jib sheet setup myself.
I've seen a couple of clever products out there that look like they might work. They basically allow you to use a short loop of line to make the connection between the sheet and clew. Darn, I can't remember the name of it right now... will dig it out.

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 01/01/2005 : 13:20:51

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by ClamBeach
 ...Have been looking around for a better, non-fouling quick-change jib sheet setup myself.
I've seen a couple of clever products out there that look like they might work. They basically allow you to use a short loop of line to make the connection between the sheet and clew. Darn, I can't remember the name of it right now... will dig it out.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

On my last boat, I just used a small snap shackle to attach the jib sheets to the headsail. To minimize bulk at the clew, I used a single line for both jib sheets with a cow hitch securing it to the clew.

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 01/01/2005 : 15:12:16

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by ClamBeach
 "I use a carabiner... When the boat rounded up this clipped itself onto the forward lower stay leaving the jib backwinded at the worst time. This I gotta fix."

Take a look at 'screw-lock' carabiners...

I'm currently using a chain 'quick link'. (A chain link that opens with a gate you unscrew to open)

Have been looking around for a better, non-fouling quick-change jib sheet setup myself.
I've seen a couple of clever products out there that look like they might work. They basically allow you to use a short loop of line to make the connection between the sheet and clew. Darn, I can't remember the name of it right now... will dig it out.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

That is what the rigging tape is for, to wrap the shackle so it cannot come open on the shrouds.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 01/01/2005 : 21:12:37

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by fhopper@mac.com
 [quote]Originally posted by ClamBeach
 That is what the rigging tape is for, to wrap the shackle so it cannot come open on the shrouds.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
I'm not sure that'd fix Jim's problem--a caribiner opens inward. I'd suggest a piston-type snap shackle. The downside of a shackle is that when the jib is flailing, a piece of steel hardware on the clew can be dangerous to somebody on the foredeck (or even the coachroof).

Edited by - on

mmac
Navigator

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USA
168 Posts

Response Posted - 01/01/2005 : 21:39:01

Jim,

Your story reminds me of the first time I ever went sailing. A friend and I were on a C-22 in a March storm. We were south of the San Diego Bay Bridge, so you can subtract a couple of feet off of the seas, but add buckets of rainwater.

Juanita and I came through the L-Dock gate with fire investigators the other night right after the fire was put out. Your are right about what would have happened if the fire had reached the Whaler's gas tanks. Of course, My boat would have shielded your boat from the blast. Thanks to Craig's heroic actions this didn't happen.

Edited by - on

lcharlot
Master Marine Consultant

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Antigua and Barbuda
1301 Posts

Response Posted - 01/01/2005 : 22:26:03

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
Stuart and Trish the couple who own the Whaler with the twin yamaha 225s had a disaster. There shore power AC apparantly started a fire. There boat is a total loss.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

That's gotta hurt! I stopped at our local outboard motor dealership (Honda, Yamaha, and Mercury) a few weeks ago to buy a spare deadman switch key for the new T8, and was looking at a Yamaha 225 or 250 (don't remember exactly which) that they had on display, mounted on the back of a bass boat. The price sticker was almost $17K - just for the motor

! I thought to myself: "This single motor by itself costs almost as much as you would pay for a Catalina 25WK Mk. IV , '88-'90, in very good condition with a trailer and 4-stroke motor!". I've heard that it's not uncommon for someone who is really into tournament bass fishing to have as much as a hundred G's wrapped up in a boat and trailer - that's what I paid for my HOUSE 15 years ago! So sorry that your friends had a boat fire! I assume this happened while the boat was sitting in the slip, unattended, and no one was injured? If it was shorepower that started the fire, I would question why the distribution panel circuit breaker or ground fault interupter didn't cut the circuit at the instant the short occured.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 01/02/2005 : 17:46:03

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by lcharlot
 If it was shorepower that started the fire, I would question why the distribution panel circuit breaker or ground fault interupter didn't cut the circuit at the instant the short occured.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
As Jim B. and I found out, sometimes a short has just enough resistance that it generates enough heat to start the insulation burning without passing enough amps to trip a breaker--just like a heater. If no current reaches the ground (third wire) in an AC system, the GFI is oblivious. You just never know...

Edited by - Dave Bristle on 01/02/2005 17:47:55

matsche
Captain

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USA
280 Posts

Response Posted - 01/02/2005 : 20:49:10

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by dlucier
 
On my last boat, I just used a small snap shackle to attach the jib sheets to the headsail. To minimize bulk at the clew, I used a single line for both jib sheets with a cow hitch securing it to the clew.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
I use the same setup with a [url="http://www.tylaska.com/T8.htm"]Tylaska T8 large bail[/url] snap shackle and it works great. The Tylaska has nothing on the outside to snag a shroud. It's light weight and can handle a work load up to 4,000 lbs. It makes changing head sails sooooo much easier.

Edited by - on

Lightnup
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1016 Posts

Response Posted - 01/02/2005 : 21:50:34

Well there ya go...the second day of the year and I've already learned something.

The PO of my boat had attached the center point of a single line directly to the headsail clew with a knot, the trailing ends being the jib sheets. He did this with both headsails so that, in order to change headsails, the jib sheets for the first sail have to be pulled forward out of the track-blocks and then the pre-attached sheets for the other headsail have to be run aft through the blocks on each side.

Now I see how much simpler and sensible it is to have one set of sheets and the right hardware to clip and unclip the headsail's clew. That's exactly why I like hanging around this great forum. (Of course, now that I've bought a boat with a rolling furler, this new knowledge is not quite as useful as it would otherwise have been but I'm sure it will come in handy sometime down the road.)

Steve

Edited by - on

cvwall
1st Mate

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USA
56 Posts

Response Posted - 01/03/2005 : 09:09:16

I think what Clam is referring to is a "Toggle". Using doubled sheets with a short length of line whipped just below the bight, pass the loop through the clew and then the short piece of line through the loop. This secures the sheets securely, and is easilly released if you want to change headsails.

Edited by - on

Oscar
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2030 Posts

Response Posted - 01/03/2005 : 09:29:35

I don't like hardware flogging around...On the 25 the clew is at knee cap level, untill you kneel/sit down to brace yourself, now the shackle is at temple level, it hurts (trust me) or worse,......I tie my sheets on with a bowline. If you don't want to mess with it while doing a headsail change I would recommend having sheets on each sail. Cuts down on the clutter in the cockpit too, as the genny sheets are longer than the jib sheets. But what do I know....

Oscar
C42 # 76 "Lady Kay" (Ex. C250 WB #618 )
Georgetown MD/Fort Lauderdale FL

Edited by - on

ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

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3072 Posts

Response Posted - 01/03/2005 : 09:51:23

"I think what Clam is referring to is a "Toggle"."

Yeah... there was a new one on the market that looked promising. Very lightweight piece of aluminum with some specially shaped slots and holes... IMHO pricey for what was there.
Will have to get around to digging out the one I was looking at.

Oscar... true enough, flogging hardware hurts...

Edited by - on

matsche
Captain

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USA
280 Posts

Response Posted - 01/03/2005 : 10:21:41

Maybe I'm missing something here, but how in the world do you position yourself to get flogged by the jib clew? Is this some sort of S&M thing you guys got going on?

Edited by - on

JimB517
Past Commodore

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USA
3285 Posts

Response Posted - 01/03/2005 : 11:07:45

Thanks for the suggestions on the toggle. I'm going to try something new, plus I discovered I lost a winch handle in all the excitement...something to spend that West marine gift card on.

New Years Day Fleet 7 had a great day sail. Conditions were perfect for relaxing sailing. Wind about 10, seas were large (6 feet) but regular and very long period. Gary on Classical Cat and I sailed out about 7 or 8 miles looking for whales and turned downwind very late in the day to chase some power boats who were reporting whales on the VHF. No luck, we couldn't catch them or the whales.

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 01/03/2005 : 11:51:19

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by matsche
 Maybe I'm missing something here, but how in the world do you position yourself to get flogged by the jib clew?...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Headsail changes primarily.

Edited by - on

Charlie Vick
Captain

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USA
423 Posts

Response Posted - 01/03/2005 : 12:19:28

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by dlucier
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by matsche
 Maybe I'm missing something here, but how in the world do you position yourself to get flogged by the jib clew?...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Headsail changes primarily.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I've asked them politely to hold still while I lowered/raised them
but they rarely do.
Been smacked more than once.
Ahh, the joys of hank ons with the halyard at the mast.

Edited by - on

ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

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3072 Posts

Response Posted - 01/03/2005 : 20:31:28

Charlie wrote... "Ahh, the joys of hank-ons with the halyard at the mast..."

Best thing I ever did to making singlehanding easier was to run the halyards aft and put a dousing line on the jib. I guess I'm just too cheap to buy one of them new-fangled jib furlers.

When I think about laying out more boat units on the C25, I find myself starting to think ahead to the next vessel... which will be a thirty-something bluewater capable rig.

Must ponder further...

Edited by - on

Gloss
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1916 Posts

Response Posted - 01/03/2005 : 20:39:45

thirty something bluewater rig. I'll assume that's a boat your are talking about. Me too, my next boat will be something like that.
Realities start with dreams

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 01/03/2005 : 21:43:28

I always back wind the headsail inside the lifelines and harden up the sheet so the clew stays put, then let go the clutch and haul on the downhaul. My clew never does anything but sit there.

Edited by - on

ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

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3072 Posts

Response Posted - 01/04/2005 : 09:23:04

"thirty something bluewater rig. I'll assume that's a boat your are talking about..."

-- ROFL. But hmm... now that you mention it....

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