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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Catalina 25 Specific Forum

Help! I am a newbie....

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cclark
Navigator

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USA
104 Posts

Response Posted - 06/09/2005 : 12:00:57

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by candria77
[br ...I am bummed that I am not an ownerr yet, but i am relieved that I didnt buy a lemon. Back to the net to find me a good boat.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Chris,
If you are still interested in the C25, There is a listing on the Swap Meet section of our board. It has a trailer and looks in good shape. He is asking under 6K
If I were out in that area, I would take a look at it. http://www.catalina25-250.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=9320
Chris

Edited by - on

existentialsailor
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1180 Posts

Response Posted - 06/09/2005 : 14:04:28

There are also 2 Catalina 25's for sale at Fay's Boatyard in Gilford NH. They have a website, but it doesn't appear to have been updated lately, you could give them a call. (603) 293-0700

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 06/13/2005 : 17:43:44

Hi Chris... You were very smart to get a survey and learned exactly why! IMHO, you're lucky to have been steered away from that boat. The swing keel was an interesting idea in its day, but one that Catalina dropped in favor of the fixed wing keel that is equally trailerable but more reliable (and safe), particularly in salt water. If you are keeping her in a slip, the wing or fin are the best way to go. They'll generally cost a little more--especially the wing--but I don't recommend berthing a 1500 lb. piece of swinging cast iron on a steel cable in salt water. Neither does Catalina Yachts.

While you're looking, continue with the learning process--lessons, sailing with anyone you can find, etc... Try some different size boats to see what you feel comfortable in. They generally sail according to the same principles, but the C-25 is a big hunk (5000+ lbs.) around a dock. You can't just "fend off" when you make a mistake--at least not without possibly hurting something, someone, or yourself. You just might decide to start smaller (e.g. 22', which is a MUCH smaller and lighter boat) and then move up. I question the wisdom of a C-25 for a beginning, single-handing sailor with a small child onboard. Just something to think about.

Good luck in your quest!

Edited by - on

candria77
Deckhand

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USA
6 Posts

Response Posted - 06/16/2005 : 17:59:18

Thanks, I appreciate the input and I plan on doing some learning and sailing this year on someone elses boat, and purchase my own next year.

Thanks again,

Chris

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Dave Bristle
 Hi Chris... You were very smart to get a survey and learned exactly why! IMHO, you're lucky to have been steered away from that boat. The swing keel was an interesting idea in its day, but one that Catalina dropped in favor of the fixed wing keel that is equally trailerable but more reliable (and safe), particularly in salt water. If you are keeping her in a slip, the wing or fin are the best way to go. They'll generally cost a little more--especially the wing--but I don't recommend berthing a 1500 lb. piece of swinging cast iron on a steel cable in salt water. Neither does Catalina Yachts.

While you're looking, continue with the learning process--lessons, sailing with anyone you can find, etc... Try some different size boats to see what you feel comfortable in. They generally sail according to the same principles, but the C-25 is a big hunk (5000+ lbs.) around a dock. You can't just "fend off" when you make a mistake--at least not without possibly hurting something, someone, or yourself. You just might decide to start smaller (e.g. 22', which is a MUCH smaller and lighter boat) and then move up. I question the wisdom of a C-25 for a beginning, single-handing sailor with a small child onboard. Just something to think about.

Good luck in your quest!

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Edited by - on

candria77
Deckhand

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USA
6 Posts

Response Posted - 06/16/2005 : 17:59:33

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 06/16/2005 : 19:33:14

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Dave Bristle
 Hi Chris... You were very smart to get a survey and learned exactly why! IMHO, you're lucky to have been steered away from that boat. The swing keel was an interesting idea in its day, but one that Catalina dropped in favor of the fixed wing keel that is equally trailerable but more reliable (and safe), particularly in salt water. If you are keeping her in a slip, the wing or fin are the best way to go. They'll generally cost a little more--especially the wing--but I don't recommend berthing a 1500 lb. piece of swinging cast iron on a steel cable in salt water. Neither does Catalina Yachts.
Good luck in your quest!

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Now Dave, are we projecting a bit? Catalina Yachts continues to ship swing keels on the 22 (they ship very few wings on 22's) and has never said the swing was a bad idea, only that the technology made wings common and the market place likes them. Don't get me wrong, I wish I had a wing but the swing is a long way from a failed design. Every so often the swing bashing begins on this forum and is always resolved with everyone admitting the Catalina swing is one heck of a well designed long lived device and no one should be afraid of one.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 06/16/2005 : 22:00:22

All I said, Frank, was that Catalina recommended against keeping the swing keel in salt water. They did. I don't remember where I read it, but it was their words.

The C-22 keel is 550 lbs--quite a bit less than 1500. I strongly suspect it's still in production mainly because of its one-design racing popularity. Every C-22 Mk II I've seen was a wing, not swing, but Mk IIs aren't allowed in the one-design class. Note that neither Catalina nor any of its competitors makes a swing keel 25-footer--meaning putting all of the ballast in the swinging keel. Actually, has any competitor ever made one? Many have made centerboards (not ballasted) housed in ballasted stub keels, and now most have gone to water ballast for trailerability.

For lake sailing and trailering, the swinger is probably fine. For a slip or mooring in salt water and sailing in the ocean, it's not the best answer--nor is an E-scow. Chris wants to put the boat in a slip in salt water on the Atlantic Coast. There are better choices than the C-25 SK for that, and we should say so.

Edited by - Dave Bristle on 06/16/2005 22:12:15

Brooke Willson
Admiral

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USA
983 Posts

Response Posted - 06/17/2005 : 06:10:17

Dave, the C25 handbook that came with the boat says the swing should not be kept in salt water.

That being said, mine's been in salt water for 20 years and, with proper maintenance, has done quite well. However, you're absolutely right that the wing or fin are preferable in the brine.

Brooke

Edited by - on

John P
Captain

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USA
324 Posts

Response Posted - 06/17/2005 : 07:14:29

Wow, I like this forum! It so informative!

I too am a newbie (to this boat) and will looking at one on sunday (fingers crossed).

I was impressed to see a reference to an E-scow! What a performance boat!!! I miss the days of sailing on those. Although I never owned a new one. I used to single hand my fathers '57 quite often back when I was in my teens.

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 06/17/2005 : 12:30:19

John,
Also note as you read this forum that most of us have been around long enough to know each other some. Dave Bristle is one of the premier members and he really knows his stuff. If you read something that sounds like a confrontation it seldom is, it is just hard to intone nuances on a forum.

Edited by - on

John P
Captain

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USA
324 Posts

Response Posted - 06/17/2005 : 14:45:29

"...If you read something that sounds like a confrontation..."

No worries here. I am on several message boards (forums) and they all work the same way.

I just found it neat that somebody else new about E-Scows. Most people I talk to that sail no nothing about them....usually because they are racing boats and not cruisers.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 06/17/2005 : 16:17:43

Thanks for the compliment, Frank, but I only know a little and there's an awful lot I don't know! Now Leon Sisson, Dave Laux, Bill Holcomb, Jim Baumgart, Derek Crawford, Steve Milby, Arlyn Stewart, you, (I could go on...) --these guys really do know their stuff! I need to remember to insert some smilies now and then... and I do occasionally say more than I know.

John and Chris--this place is indeed a great resource and a great community. Predictably, we tend not to be fully objective about our boats, and I've been known to raise some hackles when I try to inject some obectivity, looking at the C-25 as I did when I was deciding whether to buy one. Thanks mostly to this forum, I decided I would only buy a lead fin (not cast iron) or a wing, with the molded cockpit fuel locker, although that meant a somewhat later model and a higher price. That was the right choice for me (with a salt water slip)--other choices are right for other people. I want to help "newbies" get the straight story, just as others helped me five years ago.

Also, John and Chris, you may be double-clicking the Post button... You can delete your own duplicates by clicking the trashcan icon in the header to the post.

Edited by - Dave Bristle on 06/17/2005 17:09:59

ronrryan
Admiral

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USA
561 Posts

Response Posted - 06/17/2005 : 21:29:17

The very, VERY best survey is one that keeps you from buying the wrong boat!!! Buy your surveyor a beer/drink/dinner/cone as required. No dollar was ever better spent. In the meantime, reflect that there is ALWAYS another good boat for sale, waiting for you, and a C25 is a great choice! God Bless, ron srsk Orion sw fl #2343

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