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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

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fuel filter

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kjk
1st Mate

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USA
91 Posts

Initially Posted - 05/11/2016 : 17:48:29

Got one? Use it? Recommend it? I am rehabbing a 1999 Wing Keel, and had to purchase a new engine. The dealer insisted on a fuel filter which he mounted in the fuel locker. Now my 6 gallon tank, which I found with some difficulty, will not fit and I am using a 3 gallon.

Kevin J. Kiely
Rockport, MA
1999WK
Hull # 407

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9017 Posts

Response Posted - 05/11/2016 : 19:28:46

This might not be as aesthetically pleasing, but it's what I did. The Racor here probably larger than required for a 8-10 hp outboard, but a mechanic recommended the bigger version, which allows a finer filter and less impediment to flow...

At least as important as filtering is water separation, given the problems introduced by ethanol, and dubious situations with marina fuel tanks. The larger filter lets the water settle out better in its bowl (with a drain in the bottom). But luckily, I didn't see any collect in the bowl while I owned the boat. That could have been due to my fuel sources.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 05/11/2016 19:31:38

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3370 Posts

Response Posted - 05/12/2016 : 03:28:25

I can see the benefits of using a fuel filter. Anyone that has had issues with their outboard probably has considered or added a fuel filter to help avoid further issues with starting/running their outboards. But there are other factors, just as important and maybe more important. I believe a lot has to do with how frequent you run your outboard, if not run all thru the year then providing adequate winterization for it and also how old is the fuel line hose and gas tank that may have residuals in it that have built up during non-use periods that could cause some clogging issues. for many that do lay up their outboards during the winter and/or have fairly long non-use periods during the boating season, the fuel filter that Dave suggests makes sense since it not only prevents particulates from entering the outboard but also separates out the water content.

I have a 2006 9.9 Honda 4 stroke. I did not add a fuel filter. Though, some past discussions have been about a few that have had issues with Hondas due to their narrow fuel ports, etc within this outboard and keeping them clean. However, I have had my outboard for over 10 years and have never had an issue regarding clogging, water, contaminants, etc and supposedly my Honda would be one that some would suspect as being more finicky regarding clean, dry fuel. The only issue I have had in the past was that the fuel line fuel fitting that you attach to the outboard developed a crack near the o-ring. Once that fitting was replaced, no issues.

I suspect the excellent reliability I have had with my outboard is due primarily to the frequency throughout the year that I run the outboard and the regular use of a fuel additive. I use my outboard all year and about the longest I have ever gone without starting it up dockside has been perhaps 30 days during one or two extremely bad winters. Otherwise, on the average, it is started up ~ 2 times a week during the 6 months including summer and about once every week or two during the 6 months including winter. Every fill up of my 3 gallon tank, I add Startron or Stabil.

So, given my track record so far with a reliable outboard, at least for me, I see no addl benefit adding a fuel filter. But let's face it, there are plenty of things that one can do to maintain reliability and a fuel filter should be factored in as a benefit but so is utilizing an additive such as Startron or Stabil regularly and running the outboard frequently to avoid fuel residuals from building up in the fuel lines, fuel tank and within the outboard.

Larry
'89 Robin's Nest#5820, Potomac River/Quantico, Va
http://catalina25.homestead.com/olarryr.html

Edited by - OLarryR on 05/12/2016 03:41:19

TakeFive
Master Marine Consultant

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2270 Posts

Response Posted - 05/12/2016 : 06:19:06

I see absolutely no reason to add a Racor or similar fuel separator to any 4-cycle gasoline system with a portable tank. Fresh fuel solves all problems. If you don't consume it fast enough, just empty your tank into your car and start over with new fuel. If your marina has lousy gas, take your portable tank to a normal gas station.

Also, Honda outboards already have a fuel filter inside the cowl, and I believe that it is designed to trap both particulates and also to adsorb small amounts of water (not sure, but that's what I was told). I hope that all of you are replacing your Honda fuel filter annually:

Rick S., Swarthmore, PA
PO of Take Five, 1998 Catalina 250WK #348 (relocated to Baltimore's Inner Harbor)
New owner of 2001 Catalina 34MkII #1535 Breakin' Away (at Rock Hall Landing Marina)

Tradewind
Admiral

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USA
531 Posts

Response Posted - 05/12/2016 : 06:19:22

I added one of these, mounted it in the fuel locker. I use a 3 gallon tank and only need to add fuel maybe 3 times a year, I don't motor much. It's about 4" tall, you might be able to fit a 6 gallon tank in the fuel locker with it. I believe this link is for the filter itself and not the entire assembly but you can see what it looks like.

http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userportal/show_product.do?pid=6446&familyName=Racor+In-Line+Gasoline+Fuel+Filters

1998 250WK #331
CILCIA
Steve
Pensacola, FL

Edited by - Tradewind on 05/12/2016 06:23:30

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3370 Posts

Response Posted - 05/12/2016 : 09:06:37

Rick is correct in that my Honda outboard does have a fuel filter which I change out periodically when doing the othe rmtn - Spark plugs, oil and filter changeouts.

Larry
'89 Robin's Nest#5820, Potomac River/Quantico, Va
http://catalina25.homestead.com/olarryr.html

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 05/12/2016 : 11:17:55

I also have a Racor fuel / water separator mounted externally to my fuel locker (same one as shown in Dave's picture). Having been stuck with an engine that would only run at high speed due to fuel contamination, for $60 I'm not willing to not have an extra fuel filter that prevents me from having to be towed in again.

Also, having gone through my original tank rusting and spending a lot of time finding a plastic 6 gallon tank that fits, I wouldn't be willing to have any room taken up in my fuel locker that'd prevent the tank from fitting and requiring me to use a 3 gallon tank instead. If it were me, I'd relocate the fuel filter to the outside of the fuel locker where it's easy to maintain, and get the room back for the full sized tank.

David
C-250 Mainsheet Editor

Sirius Lepak
1997 C-250 WK TR #271 --Seattle area Port Captain --

Edited by - delliottg on 05/12/2016 11:21:54

kjk
1st Mate

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USA
91 Posts

Response Posted - 05/12/2016 : 18:22:20

I notice that the filters installed externally do not have enclosures. Is that a safety issue?

Kevin J. Kiely
Rockport, MA
1999WK
Hull # 407

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9017 Posts

Response Posted - 05/12/2016 : 20:24:48

Why? The fuel line runs externally--the Racor is just a component of that, fully sealed. In my mind, water separation was its main mission.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

Tradewind
Admiral

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USA
531 Posts

Response Posted - 05/13/2016 : 07:03:59

I've found the external filter is much easier to change than the filter inside my Honda 8.

1998 250WK #331
CILCIA
Steve
Pensacola, FL

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9017 Posts

Response Posted - 05/13/2016 : 07:47:24

I might add that various mechanics have strongly recommended a Racor to me--the bigger the better, they say.

Dave Bristle
Association "Port Captain" for Mystic/Stonington CT
PO of 1985 C-25 SR/FK #5032 Passage, USCG "sixpack" (expired),
Now on Eastern 27 $+!nkp*+ Sarge

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3370 Posts

Response Posted - 05/13/2016 : 08:50:14

I would also think that the Racor filter is far superior at separating out the water from the fuel compared to an outboard's in-line fuel filter. Also, the in-line fuel filter could very well become clogged if there is significant water in it and that could effect the running of the outboard.

Adding the Racor is definitely worthy of consideration especially if you do not frequently run your outboard or frequently replenish the fuel in the portable fuel tank.

Larry
'89 Robin's Nest#5820, Potomac River/Quantico, Va
http://catalina25.homestead.com/olarryr.html

islander
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3994 Posts

Response Posted - 05/13/2016 : 08:53:48

I believe you can't have a glass bowl,Plastic bowl or a quick drain on the separator.

Scott-"IMPULSE"87'C25/SR/WK/Din.#5688
Sailing out of Glen Cove,L.I Sound

Edited by - islander on 05/13/2016 09:19:52

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 05/13/2016 : 15:48:58

quote:
Originally posted by islander

I believe you can't have a glass bowl,Plastic bowl or a quick drain on the separator.

Why? They're designed that way, the separated water has to have somewhere to collect (and be drained off). I use a small Mason jar to drain mine, then let it evaporate over time.

David
C-250 Mainsheet Editor

Sirius Lepak
1997 C-250 WK TR #271 --Seattle area Port Captain --

islander
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3994 Posts

Response Posted - 05/13/2016 : 17:26:17

David I stand corrected. that rule is for inboards and below deck/enclosed areas. Outboards can use them.

Scott-"IMPULSE"87'C25/SR/WK/Din.#5688
Sailing out of Glen Cove,L.I Sound

TakeFive
Master Marine Consultant

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2270 Posts

Response Posted - 05/13/2016 : 20:09:47

Here's my problem with Racor water separators with small outboards:

With ethanol-free gas or diesel, water is completely insoluble. So any moisture drops out, leaving the gas completely unchanged. A separator to remove the moisture allows the engine to burn clean, water-free gas. No problem.

On the other hand, E10 gas will dissolve 3 teaspoons of water per gallon before it starts to phase separate. A traditional separator will only take out the phase separated water, leaving gas saturated with dissolved water. If that gas/water mixture sits long enough, acetobacter growth can generate acetic acid which will corrode engine parts (or your gas tank, if it's metal). So if your gas has sat around long enough to have water phase separating in your Racor filter, removing the phase separated water is false security. The "purified" gas still is saturated with 3 teaspoons of water per gallon, and possibly acetic acid.

So if your Racor separator shows some water in it, it means you should have thrown out your gas a few weeks ago. And it's still potentially corrosive even after you've drained the little puddle of separated water.

If you have a portable tank and don't consume your gas within 30-60 days, you should get rid of it before it phase separates by siphoning into your car where it's diluted with fresh gas and burned off within a week. If you do this, you'll never have water phase separating, and that Racor separator is just taking up space in your C250 fuel locker or becoming a trip hazard in front of your helm seat.

As I've stated elsewhere, you should also always close the vent on your gas tank when not in use, and never "burp" it by relieving the pressure. Circulating additional fresh air through the tank is just feeding moisture into the fuel.

Rick S., Swarthmore, PA
PO of Take Five, 1998 Catalina 250WK #348 (relocated to Baltimore's Inner Harbor)
New owner of 2001 Catalina 34MkII #1535 Breakin' Away (at Rock Hall Landing Marina)

Edited by - TakeFive on 05/13/2016 20:11:17

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3370 Posts

Response Posted - 05/17/2016 : 03:30:22

Off topic but I have a sort of interesting (at least to me) fuel filter story.

Many, many years ago, at the time when the first Star Wars movie came out, I was on a special assignment being one of three sent down to PSE&G's Salem Unit #1 Nuclear Power Plant to assess and replace SS heat exchanger piping. That first day when we were apprised of what the intended work was - Identify a suitable piping matl and then run their office personnel and contractors in accomplishing the piping replacement it was a long day meeting with their personnel. It ended with an inspection that night, very late, with inspecting the existing piping. I recall seeing the night crew performing some maintenance actions and all I could think of was that bar scene in the Star wars movie with those unusual characters (from all different planets). Actually, now thinking about it, it wasn't that the maintenance workers were physically unusual but many had on either just a droopy t-shirt or polo shirt and so it seemed unusual to me seeing such informality...but again it was the night shift and I suspect a much reduced manpower... skeleton crew. Anyway, when I got out of their it was after midnight and anyone having been in the lower NJ area where this plant is located, it was desolated. I was driving my 1978 Honda Civic and on one of those desolate roads, my car konked out. Here I was in the middle of nowhere and nothing within site for miles and I do not think we even had cell phones at the time or at least I did not have one. Of all vehicles to come upon me it being now around 1230am, a tow truck !!

The guy indicated there is nothing out here and not likely anyone would be by to assist, he offered to tow my car to his facility which was a few miles away and then checked out my car. Turns out that my car had 2 fuel filters in it, one was the regular one up front adjacent to the engine but he indicated there is another one located somewhere ...hard to recall after all these years but believe it was located underneath behind the driver's seat. He replaced that fuel filter and indicated it was clogged possibly from water. Anyway, I was back on my way after he replace it.

That area, actually is very nice (in the day time and other cars/activity around) but this was my first time down there, an unusual circumstance to begin with at a nuclear facility no less and then in the middle of the night with no lights, very dark and no one around and it was spooky to say the least. Anyway, that was my only time experiencing a fuel filter issue.

Larry
'89 Robin's Nest#5820, Potomac River/Quantico, Va
http://catalina25.homestead.com/olarryr.html

Edited by - OLarryR on 05/17/2016 03:44:23

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