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Torqeedo

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pastmember
Master Marine Consultant

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Initially Posted - 08/19/2014 : 20:12:14

I have a Torqeedo 1003L in my Defender Cart. I really don't want a 95 pound motor on my 22' boat and I am done pulling starter ropes so If I don't go electric start at 90 odd pounds then I need to try something different. The 1003 has an integrated Lion battery so there is no external batteries like with the larger Torqeedos. It seems to have some design issues though, the tiller does not articulate like normal OBs and the prop diameter is large so I need to check rudder clearance.
Does anyone have experience with them recently?

Edited by - on

GaryB
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Response Posted - 08/19/2014 : 20:29:11

No experience but is the shaft long enough? Are their options on the length of the shaft?

For your sailing grounds look like a viable option.

Edited by - on

OJ
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Response Posted - 08/19/2014 : 20:43:30

Have you seen Bill Holcomb's thread on his Torqeedo?

Edited by - on

Bill Holcomb
Admiral

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769 Posts

Response Posted - 08/20/2014 : 06:59:43

Hi Gary,
If you get the 1003L check the amps per hour usage rates and compare to the amp/hour rating of the Lion battery to see how many hours of "motoring" you'll be able to get.
I went with the 2.0 L Cruise. Yes, I have to use two 12 VDC batteries to get the 24 VDC that the motor needs. On Snickerdoodle (C25), there is enough room in the fuel locker for both of the batteries. I went with 110 amp/hour Group 27 deep cycle batteries and have been very pleased with the performance. The only problem I've had is if I want to go from Bayview (where my marina is) to Sandpoint (some 30+ miles away). If there's no wind at all, and I motor all the way, I have to keep the boatspeed at about 3.5 kts to make it all the way on one charge.
I do have my two 12 VDC house batteries as a backup - - and have used them as backup once when I ran out of charge on the primary bank.
Bill Holcomb - C25 Snickerdoodle #4839

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 08/20/2014 : 08:17:22

quote:
Originally posted by pastmember

Does anyone have experience with them recently?

No.

But looking at the specs, it appears the 1003 on a full charge might take you the length of Cheney and halfway back at 3.4 kts (~4 mph). So, is that enough? Do you have a charging source? Running on 29.6 VDC, there might not be a practical option for backup except their own spare battery--an accessory.

According to the drawing on the tech specs page, you can use the tiller at up to 30 degrees tilt. Enough? There's an accessory tiller extension.

For those worried about shaft length, it has two choices--the equivalents of L and XL on gas outboards. On a 22' on an inland lake, the standard length might be fine.

I think I like it!

Edited by - on

pastmember
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Response Posted - 08/20/2014 : 10:55:42

It is rare that I motor more than 100 yards and I have no issue with sailing in on occasion so the distance is not an issue. I think that with the long shaft the tiller will be above the transom while the prop is in the water.

I liked the video
http://www.torqeedo.com/us/electric-outboards/travel-503-1003-with-integrated-battery-for-inflatables-dinghies-yachts-up-to-1-5-tons/video

If I buy a solar panel I can have unlimited range in good sun, (I won't buy one for Cheney). The house battery can also be tapped. I have also gotten the impression somewhere that the motor can recharge the battery if you let it spin while sailing. An outboard that disassembles into such light components is very compelling to me. It is sad when our age makes choices for us, my Spinal stenosis is requiring LOTS of epidurals over the course of a year and pulling a rope or carrying the motor is just more than I can do now. So I need to either sell my boat for the last time or buy a Torqeedo. Maybe I should just sell and ride OP boats. Now I need to sell my Tohatsu 5hp.

Edited by - pastmember on 08/20/2014 11:13:26

dmpilc
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Response Posted - 08/20/2014 : 11:43:23

The Torqueedo is cool, but you are looking at over $2000 for a new one, more with the solar charger. For $990, on sale until 8/20, you could get a Tohatsu 3.5 long shaft(weighs 43 lbs) from Onlineoutboards that would fit your motor mount very nicely, and be plenty of power for a 22 footer. The 15" shaft is 2 lbs lighter.
For a $1,000 savings, I would put up with a pull cord a bit longer.
Also, for about $1,500, Lehr makes a nice propane powered outboard. supposedly, a lot cleaner burning, and no priming to start it.

Edited by - dmpilc on 08/20/2014 11:44:49

pastmember
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Response Posted - 08/20/2014 : 12:01:40

Defender sells them for $1650. If I can sell my Tohatsu for $750 then the cost is mitigated somewhat. Honestly though it costs a lot less than one hearing aid and I bought my wife several of those! I really like that it is self contained and I can throw my fuel can overboard.

Edited by - on

dmpilc
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Response Posted - 08/21/2014 : 17:01:17

Understood. Enjoy. I don't have the hearing aid problem yet, but it is not far away.

Edited by - on

Shoe
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Response Posted - 08/21/2014 : 17:54:10

Hello! New guy in the forum, been lurking for a while. Thanks to all for the helpful info!

Thought I'd share some:
I bought a 1003 6 months ago when I got tired of my less-than-trustworthy o/b -- special thanks to Bill Holcomb for posting his experiences.
I use mine mostly for the 100yds in/out of the marina, and it's been outstanding for the purpose. At full power (on a C25) the Torqueedo can push the boat up to almost 4knots / 2 miles, so I would imagine it would be slightly better on a C22 (if ever needed). At a 2knot cruise, I can run for a couple hours, but the lake isn't big enough for that to matter. I did have to get over "range anxiety", but experience has made me more comfortable with the limitations. I haven't hooked up a back-up connection, but might do that to add flexibility. And, no, the prop can't be used to recharge the battery -- Torqueedo does not recommend leaving the prop down when not under power (free-wheeling will damage something).

With its light weight the 1003 is easy to handle on and off the boat when I remove it. I did have to modify the transom mount so that the tiller could swing past the stern by adding aluminum "extensions" between the mount and the bracket -- with that mod, the motor maneuvers easily.

The motor isn't cheap, but it is 100% reliable and basically maintenance free, so I spend more time sailing! Pay-off on the investment comes in the form of enjoyment. There is also the fringe benefit of no oil or gas onboard, although I haven't decided yet what to put into the dumpster (I never did like having gas fumes down there).

Cheers!

Edited by - on

Dave5041
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Response Posted - 08/21/2014 : 20:02:52

Have you looked into just a trolling motor and your house battery? I used one for several years on my old Clipper 21. I think that one was 30 or 40 pound thrust, but it think you would want more. That one would charge by potting it at a lower power setting than your speed and the water overdriving the prop made it a dc generator. It was unregulated, so it required voltage monitoring and care. The bigger ones are usually electronically controlled and much more efficient at lower power settings, but probably wouldn't charge because the electronic control changes voltage pulse width instead of impedance limiting voltage/current.

Edited by - on

pastmember
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Response Posted - 08/22/2014 : 11:50:10

quote:
Originally posted by Shoe

I use mine mostly for the 100yds in/out of the marina, and it's been outstanding for the purpose. At full power (on a C25) the Torqueedo can push the boat up to almost 4knots / 2 miles, so I would imagine it would be slightly better on a C22 (if ever needed). At a 2knot cruise, I can run for a couple hours, but the lake isn't big enough for that to matter. I did have to get over "range anxiety", but experience has made me more comfortable with the limitations. I haven't hooked up a back-up connection, but might do that to add flexibility. And, no, the prop can't be used to recharge the battery -- Torqueedo does not recommend leaving the prop down when not under power (free-wheeling will damage something).

Cheers!

Thank you for posting. I sail a Starwind 223 which displaces 2450 lbs. So i am thinking the 1003L will be a good fit. I am glad it can handle a C 25. I am hesitating because of guilt. My Tohatsu is a good motor but my Spinal Stenosis makes it a poor fit for me. I am just not sure I am worth it. My kids are all in their 30s and need MONEY, should I really spend money on myself?

Edited by - on

pastmember
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Response Posted - 08/22/2014 : 11:53:16

Dave, I will research Trolling motors. I do worry about battery life. From what I read it sounds like a new battery every 5 years should be scheduled @ $600. Shoe have you noticed any degradation of the battery?

Edited by - on

OJ
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Response Posted - 08/22/2014 : 16:39:37

quote:
Originally posted by pastmember

. . . I will research Trolling motors. I do worry about battery life . . .

FWIW, we picked up a never used 55 lb. thrust Minn Kota last year for $125 while our outboard was being serviced. We went way more than 100 yards both ways. Yeah, the battery was pretty much done at days end but it served our needs.

Edited by - OJ on 08/22/2014 16:42:35

GaryB
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Response Posted - 08/22/2014 : 16:48:31

quote:
Originally posted by pastmember

[quote]Originally posted by Shoe

... I am just not sure I am worth it. My kids are all in their 30s and need MONEY, should I really spend money on myself?

Are they working? Are they healthy? Unless there is some other reason (which is none of our business) then yes you should spend money on yourself! They are adults. Doesn't mean you can't help them. Maybe just not as much?

If there is some other serious reason they need your help then only you can answer your question.

Edited by - on

Shoe
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Response Posted - 08/22/2014 : 18:40:45

quote:
Originally posted by pastmember

... any degradation of the battery?

After 6 mos of 1-2 uses per week -- no degradation, but I wouldn't expect to see it this soon anyway. I'll let you know in a couple years!

A decent trolling motor might be a good option -- I considered going that route because they're easily available and proven, but the lack of thrust is a concern. The Torqueedo 1003 has ~100lbs thrust IIRC, and it does the job I need it for, but I can't see a smaller motor handling any sort of headwind. As it is, I struggle to maintain course when I point into wind above 15 knots (doable, but requires a lot more effort, e.g. battery power). Winds above 20-25 knots on the nose would keep me out sailing

. There's a 90deg quadrant of wind direction that would stop me from getting to my slip if the wind is too strong. With my 9.9hp o/b, I could just power into it but the Torqueedo doesn't have the muscle. I don't know how well your boat handles when motoring into the wind, so you might not have the same degree of difficulty.

A trolling motor would work for in/out of the slip 90% of the time, but that other 10% could be another story. That might be dealt with by planning and friendly weather patterns, but Florida has odd T-storms in the summer.

Edited by - on

dmpilc
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Response Posted - 08/23/2014 : 06:25:41

Frank, your Starwind is just a little bit heavier than our C-22. When we bought our boat, it came with a British Seagull o/b, I'm guessing 3 hp. It took me getting caught out on our lake only once in a storm to dump that motor for a 7.5 hp Sears o/b. Had 2 of those over the years. We currently have a Merc 5hp 4 stroke and an older Mariner 4hp 2 stroke for racing (it's 15 lbs lighter than the Merc). The die-hard racers use 2.5 hp Tohatsu, Honda, or Suzuki motors and add weight to the transom to be class legal, some others use 3.5 hp motors of the same brands, which as I understand it are equivalent to the older 4 hp units. The Torqueedo 1003 is supposed to be equivalent to a 3-4hp gas o/b. It should be quite sufficient for the Starwind, <u>excluding big storms</u>. If your illness makes it difficult to pull a starter rope, go for it. Your kids will understand.
From the video I watched, the battery and the tiller handle both remove for mounting/removing the motor from the boat, so lifting weight should be minimal.
Perhaps you could find a high thrust trolling motor to borrow and try out before buying the Torqueedo?

Edited by - dmpilc on 08/24/2014 13:22:06

dmpilc
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Response Posted - 08/23/2014 : 06:37:33

According to a West Marine ad, the 1003 is equivalent to a 3 hp gas o/b and has 68 lbs static thrust. Would a 55 lb thrust trolling motor provide sufficient power? Cost for a 55 lb thrust Minkota at Bass Pro is about $300, plus another $200 for a mid-range AGM deep cycle battery.

Edited by - dmpilc on 08/23/2014 06:42:58

Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 08/23/2014 : 08:59:03

quote:
Originally posted by dmpilc

...Cost for a 55 lb thrust Minkota at Bass Pro is about $300, plus another $200 for a mid-range AGM deep cycle battery.

...and then maybe a charger.

Edited by - on

pastmember
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Response Posted - 08/23/2014 : 11:07:32

The 14 hr recharge on the Torqueedo is a bummer but the sell a fast charger, it cuts charge time to 6hrs. Why would they even sell the slow one? ... Germans...

Edited by - on

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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Response Posted - 08/23/2014 : 11:15:15

I switched between two batteries, bringing a fresh one from home about once a month and taking the one in current use home for a full charge. The sealed, flooded Walmart batteries held up well, especially for about $100. One went into Pearl when I got her and lasted several more years for a total life of about 6 years. I forgot the older one in the garage one winter and let it freeze. I had an Optima in my Miata and wasn't impressed with the cost/advantage ratio.

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Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9013 Posts

Response Posted - 08/24/2014 : 18:02:51

quote:
Originally posted by pastmember

The 14 hr recharge on the Torqueedo is a bummer but the sell a fast charger, it cuts charge time to 6hrs. Why would they even sell the slow one? ... Germans...

Why do ISPs sell faster speeds at premium prices when to do so, the have to artificially throttle down the speeds for the lower prices? MONEY.

Edited by - on

dmpilc
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Response Posted - 08/26/2014 : 09:42:30

This might be worth checking out, Minkota with 70 lb thrust:
http://www.amazon.com/MinnKota-Traxxis-Transom-Trolling-Thrust/dp/B001M5TTPO/ref=sr_1_9?ie=UTF8&qid=1409071141&sr=8-9&keywords=minn+kota+maxxum+70#cm_cr_dpwidget

or:
http://www.amazon.com/MinnKota-Traxxis-Transom-Trolling-Thrust/dp/B001M5TTPO/ref=sr_1_9?ie=UTF8&qid=1409071141&sr=8-9&keywords=minn+kota+maxxum+70
downside: 24 volt system.

Edited by - dmpilc on 08/26/2014 09:46:42

pastmember
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Response Posted - 08/26/2014 : 14:29:56

Thanks

Edited by - on

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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Response Posted - 08/26/2014 : 16:00:50

What about a [url="http://www.starmarinedepot.com/lehr-outboard-engine-2.5hp-propane-power.html?gclid=CjwKEAjw4PCfBRCz966N9pvJ4GASJAAEdM_KCXwqnBo7C7SsTsiydCwhAyLqgpsu5tD-NzNyQWNANBoCjo_w_wcB"]Lehr propane outboard[/url]?

The weight difference is about 8lbs (the Lehr is heavier), and it is a pull start, but at least you can easily bring extra propane with you, and it's half the price of the Torqeedo.

Edited by - delliottg on 08/26/2014 16:01:25

dmpilc
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Response Posted - 08/29/2014 : 11:07:34

I got the impression that Frank wants to get away from having to pull a starter rope, period.
I wish that guy who developed an electric motor that mounted to the bottom of the hull had been successful. The concept was terrific, but I think it had reliability issues.

Edited by - dmpilc on 08/29/2014 11:12:47

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