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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Catalina 25 Specific Forum

My First Big Boat...

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ColinR
1st Mate

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Canada
28 Posts

Initially Posted - 08/03/2006 : 18:46:20

My parents just purchased a 1981 Catalina 25. I am the only one in my family with solid sailing experience, (Laser and other slightly bigger boats with jib) but this is my first time with a large sail boat (or fixed keel).

Since my parents don't have time to read forums due to their busy schedule, I thought I would be the one to learn as much as I can about the boat to help them out, so that is why I am here.

Fortunately the marina that we chose has a wireless connection throughout the marina, so if I find a problem that I am not sure about I can log on to my lap top and ask the experienced here all from the comfort of my cockpit.

I will try and get pictures later in high resolution, so that perhaps you all can suggest things that should be fixed by what you see.

As for the boat, it has been sitting in a cradle for several years, so its in very good condition, but the ropes appear to be rotten; those will be changed.

Currently I have two questions,

1. Looking at the keel bolts, they appear to be in decent shape and should only require a scotch pad to look brand new again. However there is a thick tar like substance that surrounds the bolts and everything in that area which I am curious about...Is it foreign build-up or is it supposed to be there to act like a sealent for the bolts? I will try to get a picture later to show what I mean.

2. Does the boat have a ballast, or are the people in the boat supposed to act as the live ballast? If yes, where do I fill the ballast?

Thanks for your time.

1981 Catalina 25
Midland, Ontario

Edited by - on

djn
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1561 Posts

Response Posted - 08/03/2006 : 19:22:46

Congrats on the new boat. I don't know much about the bolts for the keel as I have a swing keel, but I know that there are not many products that you would want to encase the bolts with. If moisture gets in between the bolts and tar, they will rust or rot even faster. Your better of just leaving them exposed and keeping the moisture build up down by using solar fans. CHeers.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 08/03/2006 : 19:29:25

Welcome, Colin (and parents)! Yup, there's lots of ballast, but it would help for many questions if we knew the year, keel type (swing, fin, or wing), and rig type (standard or tall). Ballast ranges from 1500 to 1900 lbs, depending on the keel. Each type produces a reasonably "stiff" boat that will stand up to a good breeze no matter where you happen to be sitting. You can tell by the "stiffness" when you step aboard.

Again, the keel type, year (or hull number) will tell us something about the keel bolts. Starting around 1983, Catalina switched from a cast iron fin keel with mild steel bolts to a glass-encased lead keel with stainless bolts. The brown crud you see is probably due to rainwater in the bilge causing algae growth over time. Most of our boats get a little rainwater down there from somewhere or other, so that's not a big issue.

Keep in touch--as you can see, every question gets lots of attention!

Edited by - on

ColinR
1st Mate

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Canada
28 Posts

Response Posted - 08/03/2006 : 20:39:27

Hi, thanks for the prompt responses.

So far, I gather that the tar is normal or that it is algae growth from rainwater.. I will get confirmation with a photo later.

As for the boat, its is a fin keel or it looks exactly like the top boat in this picture...

The boat does feel very sturdy as we step on to it, barely dipping to the side that we step on.

The boat is an 1981. As for the rig style, I am not sure. We have not put the sails up yet, but apparently the boat came with 3 sets of sail, including kevlar sails! As my dad and I were working on the boat we struck up a conversation with a sailer who just docked across from our space and they mentioned that it appeared to be set up for racing. It will be a while yet till we realize the full potential of the boat, but it is nice knowing what we are capable of.

Edited by - on

stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 08/04/2006 : 01:28:18

Welcome aboard Colin.
The best way to get help on this site is to know as much about your own boat as possible, and to read as many of the previous threads about pertinent questions as possible. This allows you to frame a question in a manner that will get you the best possible set of responses.
When I bought my 1981 C25 SK/SR in Nov '04 from a broker, I contacted the previous owner and asked him a lot of questions.

Two things that really helped 1) this forum 2)racing.

We really didn't have any interest or intention to race when we bought this boat, but we're glad we did, as we've advanced along the learning curve much faster than if we had not raced.
Read some of the previous threads from first time owners of these boats and you will get a wealth of info on what you should do and can do to make things smoother.

Where is your boat moored?

Post some pictures of your boat. Take a look at Frank Hopper's website. If you have a digital camera, take a lot of pictures of your boat so that when you have a questions, you can pull a 'file' picture and post it along with your question.

Edited by - on

Justin
Admiral

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502 Posts

Response Posted - 08/04/2006 : 07:27:40

Hey Colin,
Congrats to you and your parents on buying the boat. You will definitely have some good times with your Catalina. Look forward to seeing your pictures. We love seeing photos of our C-25s. Another tip to add to stampeder's suggestion of taking lots of pics... I upload all mine to a photo hosting site. This way I can access them from any computer with an Internet connection, which has actually come in handy many times. Another reason is if you want to share them, plus they are always backed up.

About your ropes, try washing them first. When I bought my boat, some of the lines had some algae or whatever on them. I put them in some laundry net bags and threw them in the wash with some Oxy Clean and detergent. They came out looking much better.

Welcome to this site! You will find so much information and many helpful, knowledgeable owners.

Edited by - on

esailor
Navigator

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USA
118 Posts

Response Posted - 08/04/2006 : 08:52:16

Yup I've said it for years. The BEST way to learn to sail is to race!

It forces you to sail the boat at its optimum potential. While you are sailing you have other boats to compare with and you can make adjustments to try to match speeds. It also gives you definite points to sail to. Do not worry about how you place as much as just participating in the race. I promise you will learn form racing.

Edited by - on

ColinR
1st Mate

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Canada
28 Posts

Response Posted - 08/08/2006 : 18:33:50

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by stampeder
 

Where is your boat moored?

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

The boat is moored at the Doral Marina in Midland.

I have two questions right now,

First is, the boat has been sitting in a cradle for sometime, with gas still in the tanks. The marina people that put our 9.9 Honda Outboard on also filled the main and reserve tanks up. This means that the gas that has been sitting in the tanks for years has now been mixed with the new gas. Should we be concerned about running the motor with the old gas/new gas. I am sure the old gas has seperated and probably wouldn't be good for the motor. The people at the marina suggested fuel stabilizer. Should we go with this?

Secondly, there is some heavy discolouration on the deck, I think the previous owner may have used toilet cleaner (Vim) on the deck and which caused some yellowing. Along with some stains on the bow deck from the spinnaker cables. We have tried some hydro-chloric acid, with little results. Mind you, the bottle of acid was quite old, but I don't think hydro-chloric acid loses its strength. We also tried rubbing compound with no results. I may try CLR or Oxiclean next. Any other suggestions? One other thing, we can only see the discolouration when the deck is wet.

I will post some pictures of the boat soon, I worked all weekend sanding down the teak and going through the Starbrite steps. Clean/Brightener/Oil. We put it on just before we left, so it hadn't fully dried yet. It looked good though.

Edited by - ColinR on 08/08/2006 18:40:10

Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 08/08/2006 : 19:13:08

Welcome.

A few things for you

First - only two ropes are on a sailboat (bolt and foot) so your lines (aka sheets and halyards look like they are deteriorated. Try cleaning them first...might just be grime. DO NOT USE BLEACH oxygenated cleaners and fabric cleaners will work best. Just let them soak, then soak them to rinse as well. Coil and hang them from the boom or rail to dry.

On to the other questions -

Keel Bolts - That crud could be a lot of things...I'm sure Bristle chimed in regarding a year(I'm only guessing cuz I saw he posted. you'll learn well I rarely read the other posts above.) It could be tar or dirt or black caulk for that matter. The year plus a few pictures would help us figure it out. Until then, IF it ain't leakin, don't fix it.

Your keel (all 1500+ lbs of it) is your ballast.

Guys - Was a installed gas tank ever Stock?????? I think your "tanks, unless removable and it sounds like they aren't were add ons. Wait for further info on this one. I'm not sure I would have refilled them - however I'll wait for you to chime in with more details. If the marina people said fuel stabilizer, I'd go with fuel stabilizer.

Discoloration - if you can't scrub it with the regular boat soap or starbrite deck cleaner, try sparingly some acetone. (don't use that hydrocloric anymore...not good) If the acetone works, clean the area, then rinse heavily. You don't want to use that stuff (or your acid) regularily.

You mention Spinnaker Cables. Not sure what you mean by those, pole bridles, halyards, there are a number of wires on the original that might be prone to rust and rust damage.

dw

Edited by - on

ColinR
1st Mate

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Canada
28 Posts

Response Posted - 08/08/2006 : 19:35:37

Sorry, by tanks I mean regular gasoline containers that are removable. The previous owner just left the containers in the boat while it was being stored for the years...probably not a good idea.

When the marina technicians came to put our outboard on we never told them that the gas in the containers was old, so it is not their fault. We just don't know if we should scrap the new/old gas mixture and just get some brand new gas or use the fuel stabilizer. The honda O/B is relativley new with less than 50 hours of use.

Edited by - on

jerlim
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1484 Posts

Response Posted - 08/08/2006 : 19:42:49

Colin,
SCrap the old gas tanks, new ones are cheap by comparison. Protect the new O/B.
Jerry

Edited by - on

Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 08/08/2006 : 20:00:43

I second the tanks....new plastic tanks are very inexpensive.

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 08/09/2006 : 08:38:26

First welcome aboard, Colin!

Edited by - dlucier on 08/09/2006 08:42:10

stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 08/09/2006 : 12:36:41

Get rid of the gas cans and replace the fuel line. Your Honda uses straight unleaded gas. No additives. Check your manual or go on-line or call your local Honda dealer when the marina suggests an additive. My local Honda dealer told me to put gas in the gas can, and oil in oil resevoir. Nothing else. My Honda 9.9 is 7 years old and runs like a top.
I wanted to put a gas filter on my fuel line but my Honda guy told me to get a new gas can and fuel line every couple of years instead. Honda does sell a fuel line filter but they are vague as to where it should be placed.
You have to be able to rely on your OB. A fuel line is $20 and a gas can is $30. Very cheap insurance. A tow job is going to cost you at least $100. A trip to the Honda repair shop is going to cost you $200.

Edited by - on

ColinR
1st Mate

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Canada
28 Posts

Response Posted - 08/09/2006 : 19:59:59

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by dlucier
 First welcome aboard, Colin!

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by ColinR
 ...Secondly, there is some heavy discolouration on the deck, I think the previous owner may have used toilet cleaner (Vim) on the deck and which caused some yellowing.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Is this yelowing all over or in just a few spots?

The reason I ask is, I once ordered a jar of supposedly color matched gelcoat from CD to make a repair, and it had a buttery colored tone to it instead of white. I'm guessing it was on it was on the shelf too long. Additionally, I've seen gelcoat repairs on other boats that also had a yellowish tint.

Just a thought.

Oh, as to your questionable gas...lose it. I'd even consider replacing the tanks (and fuel lines). Cheap insurance for the peace of mind.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Thanks for the advice on the gas container from everyone so far. I think I am going to definitley go with what you all suggested. You guys couldn't have said it better, would you rather replace a gas container and fuel line or a whole engine? Thanks for that.

As for the discolouration, it only appears in certains spots on the deck but in large blotches. It is the worse in the cockpit. One other thing is that the discolouration can only be seen when it is wet. I think your theory is probably right dlucier. Thanks.

Edited by - ColinR on 08/09/2006 20:00:23

Gambit
Navigator

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USA
160 Posts

Response Posted - 08/10/2006 : 15:53:58

I agree on the fresh fuel. At the risk of appearing too cheap or green. You can use that old fuel in your vehicle at the rate of a gallon per tank or so. The savings from that will pay for half your new tank, or a good 12-pack to take aboard.

Good luck with the boat.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 08/10/2006 : 19:58:44

The Honda dealer here told me that Honda recommends stabilizer in the gas--generally half the specified amount for gas you'll be using in the near term. The dealer suggested that if a tank is not likely to be refilled for a month or more, then use the full prescription of stabilizer. Meanwhile, the mechanics around here report five times the normal number of problems due to bad fuel.

Edited by - on

Dustysailz
1st Mate

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USA
85 Posts

Response Posted - 08/10/2006 : 21:34:25

colin congratulations on the boat. i,m certain you will enjoy it. as others have pointed out in your house, or when hanging clothers you may use rope. however, as soon as it hits the boat it becomes: line.

the old gas, if it was my boat would be used in the lawnmower or edger. i'd scrap it myself. better to spend $20 for a new tank, $12 for a new fuel line than $2000 for a new motor!

acid and acetone to clean a boat-not good. on the topsides or hull if needed use colonite fleetwax fiberglass cleaner. it cleans really well and leaves a protective film (it will also clean your stainless steel stanchions).

for the top of the cabin and desk i use softscrub with bleach. it can be used sparingly when applied with a small bristle brush. dont let it dry before you rinse it off. you may find after cleaning that your blemished areas will disappear either due to cleaning or being in the sun again.

i jumped at the chance when asked by a sailing friend to race with him on tuesday nights in the local club races. he is a knowledgeable and able seaman and his 28' sea sprite, "calamari" is a joy to sail and i have learned much. he of course has learned from me also.

other than that this site you are learning very quickly can be a valuable tool. one last piece of advice. do consider a boating safety class and a membership in an on water tow service: it is invaluable. up here in rhode island even a tow from a soft grounding is a setback of approximately $500.

good luck, good sailing and may your jib sheets ne'er get tangled in your prop!

Edited by - on

stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 08/11/2006 : 13:45:59

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">The Honda dealer here told me that Honda recommends stabilizer in the gas<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"> Dave Bristle

This makes me want to have another chat with my Honda dealer.

Edited by - on

ColinR
1st Mate

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Canada
28 Posts

Response Posted - 08/11/2006 : 22:31:17

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by stampeder
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">The Honda dealer here told me that Honda recommends stabilizer in the gas<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"> Dave Bristle

This makes me want to have another chat with my Honda dealer.

his message to me was, make sure you have clean gas and he dismissed the idea of stablizers.

I just called and spoke to a service tech. He said if gas is one month old he would put in an ounce of stabilzer to keep the octane up.
Okay, now that I've wasted a good part of a morning I may have to have another rant. Now I'm cranky.
Thank you for your reply Dave.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

A month ehhh? With my gas we are talking a couple years. haha. I don't think fuel stabilizer can save it now.

Edited by - on

sweetcraft
Admiral

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USA
816 Posts

Response Posted - 08/12/2006 : 00:21:00

Good idea to stabilize the fuel with my new honda it wouldn't start the first time after installed on the boat because the fuel used to test and demonstrate unit to me was left in until ready to launch, four months earlier. New hondas have feature to drain fuel from engine and a fuel filter, a very good idea. I replace my fuel line with fire resistant line and no fittings at the tank. Quick release fittings outside of hull so no dribble in the boat. Congratulations on getting the boat and finding out about the Forum. Have a great sail.

Edited by - on

ColinR
1st Mate

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Canada
28 Posts

Response Posted - 08/14/2006 : 19:39:21

This is the tar that I am talking about.

[http://img148.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rimg0301pl6.jpg]

It is starting to peel now in some sections.

[http://img99.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rimg0302li3.jpg]

[http://img99.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rimg0303jn7.jpg]

The state of the bolts

[http://img77.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rimg0309wx0.jpg]

Can someone explain this set-up and what the inner runner/pulley is for (spinnaker??)

[http://img204.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rimg0304ve9.jpg]

The Honda

[http://img77.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rimg0306sa3.jpg]

Any of this junk still useful? I assume its pretty much obsolete.

[http://img96.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rimg0310bx9.jpg]

Not bad looking teak for a 25 year old boat. Last week I sanded down all the teak and then used the three part step from Star Brite. Teak Cleaner,Brightner, and then finally two coats of oil.

[http://img154.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rimg0312rw9.jpg]

[http://img231.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rimg0313lf8.jpg]

[http://img141.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rimg0315qa8.jpg]

[http://img95.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rimg0316kf1.jpg]

[http://img95.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rimg0317jb4.jpg]

This is a very stubborn stain to get off. I think it might be from the spinnaker bridles??? We have tried everything, hydrochloric/acetone/rubbing compound. Maybe CLR or Oxynext?

[http://img145.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rimg0318ch4.jpg]

The discolouration when the deck is wet, that I was talking about. Can you see it??

[http://img222.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rimg0288uw1.jpg]

And finally this boat used to be a member of this club a long time ago,

[http://img66.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rimg0286cu6.jpg]

The old name. Mom hated it. She didn't want everyone at the marina thinking her name was 'Evita'

[http://img144.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rimg0287ie8.jpg]

Edited by - ColinR on 08/14/2006 20:13:05

Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 08/14/2006 : 21:05:45

That is a block, more specifially a fairlead block or a jib block, on some boats they might be referred to as jib cars.

It looks like your set for the inboard sheeting jib - I believe it was an option in the later years - but I'm not sure when. You will find this more often than not on the Tall rigs and usually on racers. That plus the backside of either a race course card or tacking angle card behind the LORAN (wow that's some old school electronics) was also an indicator. You'll find a jib with a flatter foot and probably a little less depth, probably the laminate one, somewhere in that stack of sails.

I believe this years national champion (mike humphries) had an inboard sheeted genoa.

The inboard sheeting jib is going to give you better upwind point. Spinnaker turning blocks or cars would be generally located as far aft as possible.

Edited by - on

djn
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1561 Posts

Response Posted - 08/14/2006 : 22:28:53

I think the gov is going to shut down all Loran stations soon or they might have already. The speaker is a great idea. I have to stick my head in the cabin to hear my radio. The fish finder can still read depth so you can use that as well. Ofcourse the bracket is cool and you don't have to spend $70.00 at WM for one. So, get rid of the loran and mount a Garmin 172C in its place and mount a small portable DVD player next to it and you can sail and watch Captain Ron at the same time. Cheers.

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 08/15/2006 : 12:46:37

That is the nicest rigged 25 I have ever seen, someone spent a ton of money on that boat.

Edited by - on

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