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Fabs
Deckhand

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5 Posts

Initially Posted - 02/05/2007 : 22:39:14

Comrades,

My first post here. Not sure of protocol here so let me know if I am breaking any rules.

Looking for a new Main for my 89 Catalina 25 Tall Rig. I was at Stricly Sail in Chicago this weekend & spoke with UK, Doyle & Cruising Direct. Everyone seems to be in in-line on pricing.

Are these boats uniform enough that I should be able to order this sail without any type of measurements from the mast/boom?

Regards,
Christopher

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 02/06/2007 : 06:16:17

Hi and welcome.
Where do you sail around St. Louis? I have new in-laws in Alton. Last spring at the wedding reception I made sure to get over to the St. Louis Sailing Center; nice people, I bought a Hobie Kayak from them.

To answer your question about our boats measurements, yes we are such a known entity that I see no reason to bother measuring unless you have a specific issue unique to your boat. You may in fact want to consider a change to your sail plan. Many tall rigs regret the low position of the boom, it makes for ducking and ann uncomfortable bimini. The standard rig has its boom one foot higher. You might want to consider moving your gooseneck up a foot and ordering a custom sail. If you want to stay stock then you have another consideration; off the shelf or custom. Many online sources have our sails on the shelf which might be the best way for you to go this time of year. A custom sail may take a while.

Here in Wichita we Catalina people tend to use Gary Swensen of
http://www.ullmanventura.com/
He makes a lot of the stock Catalina Yachts sails, he makes the "off the shelf" sails sold by
http://www.catalinadirect.com/ (not Catalina Yachts)
and he makes great custom sails. I have an off the shelf main and a custom headsail. There are good sails to be found everywhere, it is the relationship that you begin that you might want to consider.

I have an 89 as well and there are a lot of photos of it and my previous 82 at the site in my sig. Look around and feel free to ask any questions.

Edited by - Frank Hopper on 02/06/2007 06:16:54

existentialsailor
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1180 Posts

Response Posted - 02/06/2007 : 06:44:52

I always recommend Harry at [url="http://www.epsails.com/"]EP Sails[/url] because he makes great sails has given me excellent service and advice.

Edited by - on

Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 02/06/2007 : 06:54:30

Many sail makers come to our site, or any other number of sites that have boat specs. As Frank mentioned, if nothing has changed you can order a sail just off the shelf. I know cruising direct has about 5 of our mains sitting ready to go. When some of the larger lofts build a bigger sail, they will take the scrap material and figure out what they can build - we fit into that smaller category especially with dacron sails.

Depending on your usage, the sailmaker can build in extra roach or foot based on backstay length, boom length etc. If you are racing, they generally will build a sail that conforms to MORC and IOR rules as well. (which are generally considered max sizes for cruisers too) For example I put a bigger roach on my sail since our class doesn't have maximum LP measurements for the main.

I would recommend that if you don't buy from a loft that has one on the shelf that you go to a loft that will build your sail from scratch on site. There is less margin for error compared to the guy that takes the order sends it to the Middle of nowhere to be cut and then sews it together once the cut pieces are shipped to him.

Our links page has many lofts listed - Gary Swensen at Ullman (in Ventura), Greg Koski at Doyle Cleveland, Cruising Direct and Sobstad Cleveland all helped the association out greatly last year with solid donations for nationals. First and Second Overall both sailed with Sobstad sails out of Cleveland.

Edited by - on

DaveR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2015 Posts

Response Posted - 02/06/2007 : 09:48:01

Hi Christopher,
Welcome to the forum! I didn't see anyone recommend "Cruising Direct". I haven't bought a sail from them yet but have heard nothing but good stuff and they're hundreds of dollars cheaper. They carry C-25 sails and you don't have to give them your email, phone, address etc. to get a quote. I didn't see a quote on tall rig sails, but I'll bet they're available. Here's the link.
p.s. If anyone's heard bad stuff about Cruising Direct I'd appreciate a heads up as I'll be purchasing a Jenny in the near future. Thanks!
http://www.cruisingdirect.com/InStockCatalinaSails.htm

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 02/06/2007 : 10:32:29

Welcome to the forum, Christopher!

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5932 Posts

Response Posted - 02/06/2007 : 10:33:25

I ordered a new genoa and mainsail from Cruising Direct at the Annapolis Sailboat Show, and they were delivered a few weeks ago, so I haven't used them yet, but they look very good. CD, which is a subsidiary of North, says their sails are identical to North sails. The difference is that they won't go to your boat and measure it for you (They probably won't need measurements for a C25), and they won't go out with you and show you how to use them. North offers more service with their sails. With either CD or North, you can specify either a cruising cut or a performance cut for your sails. One of our members told me North was offering a 25% discount on their sails at the Chicago Sailboat Show, and he said that was very close to the price he was quoted by Cruising Direct.

Edited by - on

crcalhoon
Captain

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USA
303 Posts

Response Posted - 02/06/2007 : 11:23:05

My wife's birthday present last year was a new 110% jib from Cruising Direct. She likes it very fine, thank you, and so do I. The price was right, the fit good, and it seems to me to be a very well done sail. As stated, they have all our measurements on file.

Edited by - on

Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 02/06/2007 : 11:56:19

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by DaveR
 Hi Christopher,
Welcome to the forum! I didn't see anyone recommend "Cruising Direct". I haven't bought a sail from them yet but have heard nothing but good stuff and they're hundreds of dollars cheaper. They carry C-25 sails and you don't have to give them your email, phone, address etc. to get a quote. I didn't see a quote on tall rig sails, but I'll bet they're available. Here's the link.
p.s. If anyone's heard bad stuff about Cruising Direct I'd appreciate a heads up as I'll be purchasing a Jenny in the near future. Thanks!
http://www.cruisingdirect.com/InStockCatalinaSails.htm

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I mentioned them above…

Beside them being a sponsor of the nationals last year and providing a sail for a door prize the folks I too have a 150 Jib from them. It is a solid quality sail. Not the greatest, but by no means not the worst. You will get many many years of use from it with proper care handling etc.

They did have an inside sales rep hit our website in the past and send email solicitations, but he is long since gone. I'd recommend them, especially for the cruising crowd.

Edited by - on

rclift
Navigator

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USA
152 Posts

Response Posted - 02/06/2007 : 20:51:02

Christopher,

Make sure that you get two reefs for your tall rig. The first reef is about equal to a full main of the standard rig. I find that I need to reef much earlier and more often then my stan. rig friends.

Edited by - on

Fabs
Deckhand

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5 Posts

Response Posted - 02/07/2007 : 13:34:37

Comrades,

Many thanks for all of the responses. Clearly I have come to the right place.

The folks from Cruising direct were very helpful at the Chicago Strictly sail show. More so than any of the other manufactures. They spent quite a bit of time talking to me about sail construction.

My only issue is that we have a UK rep in St. Louis & I like the idea of local support. UK would make this sail in Chicago. The Cruising direct are made overseas (that is what their rep told me). Not that that is a problem. I just like keeping it all close to home if there are any issues with the sail.

Regards,
Christopher

Edited by - on

Admin
Forum Admin

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460 Posts

Response Posted - 02/07/2007 : 15:45:21

Most if not all Cruising Direct Sails can be serviced at the North lofts (their parent company)

Edited by - on

bigelowp
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1813 Posts

Response Posted - 02/07/2007 : 18:43:04

I have also been looking for new sails for my 25 tall rig. The best price I have found for new sails is from National Sails -- has anyone used them before? They were less expensive than Cruising Direct, and they have been very responsive over the phone.

Edited by - on

ct95949
Captain

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Aruba
300 Posts

Response Posted - 02/07/2007 : 19:23:47

Christopher-
When I replaced my main and jib 2 years ago I shopped most of the outfits listed above .I ended up buying a full batten main and a 110 rf jib from Gary Swenson at Ullman Ventura. They were built very strong and at a good price and they were built overseas. The best thing about the deal was all the great advise I got from Gary. He gets my vote.

Edited by - on

DaveR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2015 Posts

Response Posted - 02/08/2007 : 09:11:02

Duane,
Ahhh, I see that you did mention CD, I stand corrected and thanks everyone for the info.

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 02/08/2007 : 09:49:24

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by ct95949
 I ended up buying a full batten main and a 110 rf jib from Gary Swenson at Ullman Ventura. They were built very strong and at a good price and they were built overseas.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I've been toying with the idea of replacing my main and when I do, it'll be either an Ullman or North (I am a fan of N/S). Not that it makes any difference to me, but I was under the impression that Gary's outfit actually made the sails.

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 02/08/2007 : 12:04:45

Call Gary and ask him which ones are done overseas and which ones are done in his loft. 1-800-248-2892

Edited by - on

Alan Clark
Captain

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406 Posts

Response Posted - 02/14/2007 : 20:01:21

Chris, We bought a new Main for "Leprechaun" and now have bought a new roller Furler and a new headsail. We did ALOT of research. So of what you spend on a sail has to be decided on how long you intend to have the baot. What kind of sailing you do. How responsive will the sailmaker be if there is a problem or warranty issue. We have bought Both sails from Doyle Detroit- Al Declerq, who not only sails but also races. The pricing was relatively close

but we opted for Good reliable service,just in case. I would also recommend the second reef,full batton main, loose foot. Too much Fun.

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5932 Posts

Response Posted - 02/15/2007 : 08:48:31

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by bigelowp
 I have also been looking for new sails for my 25 tall rig. The best price I have found for new sails is from National Sails -- has anyone used them before? They were less expensive than Cruising Direct, and they have been very responsive over the phone.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">I haven't had experience with National Sails, but they are a deep discount sailmaker, and I bought a new sail from a deep discount sailmaker once when I needed a new sail and my son was in college. The sails on my boat were hanked-on. The sail they sent me was made for a roller furler, which is cut completely differently from a hanked-on sail, and they just added hanks to it. I got what I paid for, and made do with it, but you can get much better sails than that for a fair price.

Better sailmakers, like Gary Swenson and Cruising Direct and others, will make a sail for you that is not only specifically designed to fit your boat, but that is also specifically designed for your particular use, such as racing or cruising, and their prices aren't that much more.

Edited by - on

tinob
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1883 Posts

Response Posted - 02/15/2007 : 10:11:46

Christopher, Steve is right on as usual. I use Gary Swenson's sails exclusively,(can't speak for CD), never had an occasion to go there being satisfied with Gary's Ullman sails. I made a mistake way back when, buying sails for a newly bought boat that I was told was a standard rig. When I ran the sail up the mast it suddenly became obvious that the PO made a mistake selling me a tall rig as a st'd rig. And so here I am with a brand new sail that didn't fit. I spoke to Gary and told him of my problem to which he answered simply, " send it back, there will be will be a new one the way to you as soon as I receive the old one". No questions, no finger pointing, no problem. I've been with Ullman ever since.

Val on the hard DAGNABIT # 3936, Patchogue, N.Y.

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 02/17/2007 : 08:29:24

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by tinob
 Christopher, Steve is right on as usual. I use Gary Swenson's sails exclusively,(can't speak for CD), never had an occasion to go there being satisfied with Gary's Ullman sails. I made a mistake way back when, buying sails for a newly bought boat that I was told was a standard rig. When I ran the sail up the mast it suddenly became obvious that the PO made a mistake selling me a tall rig as a st'd rig. And so here I am with a brand new sail that didn't fit. I spoke to Gary and told him of my problem to which he answered simply, " send it back, there will be will be a new one the way to you as soon as I receive the old one". No questions, no finger pointing, no problem. I've been with Ullman ever since.

Val on the hard DAGNABIT # 3936, Patchogue, N.Y.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

The same thing happened to my slightly addled friend who ordered a standard rig main for his tall rig 28, Gary simply made him another and there was no issue.

Edited by - on

Gloss
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1916 Posts

Response Posted - 02/18/2007 : 09:20:45

Both of my sails were made by Gary Swenson of Ullman Ventura.
When I bought my new main he explained that he designs the sails at his loft and sends the design to the loft in Hong Kong. He procures the sail cloth here in the US and sends the cloth to the loft in Hong Kong.
So the design and materials are US, but fabrication in Hong Kong.
If you buy a sail from gary he will make you an anchor riding sail for about 80 if ordered at the same time. That's a steal.

Edited by - on

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