Association Forum - Audio Speakers

Assn Members Area · Join

Home.

Association Forum

Ships Store

Cruising

Racing

Technical Tips

Photo Gallery - New

Boat Search - Updated

Manuals & Brochures

Swap Meet

Links

Officer Flag Line & Staff

Bylaws & Constitution

Members Area

Join the Association

Notice:
The advice given on this site is based upon individual or quoted experience, yours may differ.
The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.

Association Forum

Username:	Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

All Forums

Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Catalina 25 Specific Forum

Audio Speakers

New Topic

Topic Locked

Printer Friendly

Author

Topic

Page: of 2

Bortiquai
1st Mate

Member Avatar

88 Posts

Initially Posted - 01/10/2009 : 12:14:57

What are some people using for Audio Speakers? I am really trying to avoid cutting a 6+ inch hole some where, so that leaves me with the cube/bookshelf style.

I'd like there to be good sound, but by no means am i an audiophile expert. I looked at the Bose 151 outdoor speakers, but I think they are too big for inside the cabin of a C-25. Anyone have some nice small cubes that sound decent?

Thanks

Edited by - on

swanny
Deckhand

Members Avatar

USA
24 Posts

Response Posted - 01/10/2009 : 15:56:58

I bought these off Amazon and mounted them facing aft on the port and stbd bulkheads. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00081NX5U/ref=olp_product_details?ie=UTF8&me=&seller=
They are no Bose 151's but they sound good and the price was right and they come with mounting brackets. I've only had them for a month or two but so far so good. I mounted an inexpensive automotive amp under the companionway steps and just play off my ipods through an RCA input.
Enough good sound to be heard in the cockpit.
Good Luck!
Corey

Edited by - on

Even Chance
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
393 Posts

Response Posted - 01/10/2009 : 16:01:30

There are many, many threads on this topic in the archives. Search on "speakers."

Among audiophiles, BOSE stands for "Buy Other Sound Equipment." Bose spends more on advertising than all other speaker makers combined. The alternative speakers you'll find at big box stores -- and the uninformed high school kids working there -- won't give you any good options. Bose speakers -- incredibly overpriced for their mediocre technology -- sound just better enough than the speakers that come with most low end sound systems that people think they're good speakers. If you can find a real hi-fi store (they're pretty rare these days), go listen to some really good speakers -- Dali, Quad, Paradigm, Thiel, etc. They're absurdly expensive, but, in a comparison sailors might understand, it's the difference between a Hinckley and a MacGregor. Bose is Hunter.

For the same money as Bose, check out Klipsch, Polk, Infinity. And, amazingly, the little speakers from Radio Shack give you a lot of bang for the buck.

Edited by - Even Chance on 01/11/2009 05:19:58

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

Members Avatar

USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 01/10/2009 : 16:07:39

I just read an article in an old Practical Sailor that gave highest marks to Bose 131 speakers, but I think all of the tested speakers required cut outs to install them. They may have done a similar article on bookshelf style speakers. You might try searching their archives as well.

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 01/10/2009 : 18:08:31

I have indoor/outdoor speakers mounted on each side of the bulkhead facing aft, connected to a Dual AM/FM/CD radio mounted in the bulkhead behind the sink. They sound great, plenty of volume for the cockpit, and no big holes, just the mounting screws for pivot mounts. Bought on ebay. The only con is that they are fairly heavy.

Edit 1/11/09: Acoustic Audio, white color

Edited by - dmpilc on 01/11/2009 22:25:10

Rich P
1st Mate

Members Avatar

USA
77 Posts

Response Posted - 01/10/2009 : 18:35:58

I got a set of speakers off ebay (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/New-PYLE-5-25-100-Watt-Marine-Audio-Boat-Speakers-NR_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ26444QQihZ010QQitemZ200293115805QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW). The holes were cut already so that wasn't much of a concern and the price was cheap. On my Pacemaker I have the Bose 151's. They are decent, but for the price there is better out there. If you have music on an iPhone or iPod (or similar) the Apple speaker dock system sounds good and can be run off "d" batteries. http://cgi.ebay.com/Apple-iPod-Hi-Fi-Dock-Speaker-System-NEAR-MINT_W0QQitemZ220342520579QQihZ012QQcategoryZ84082QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Edited by - on

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

Members Avatar

USA
3758 Posts

Response Posted - 01/10/2009 : 18:59:56

I like the Bose dock for an excellent blend of size and sound.

Edited by - on

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
5408 Posts

Response Posted - 01/10/2009 : 21:58:13

Speakers have magnets and magnets will generally affect your compass.
Many boat speakers are "magnetically shielded" which provide some relief.
But even these can cause some magnetic deviation.
If you install speakers, amps, cables on your boat, afterward it's good to check your fixed mount and hand-bearing compasses by taking a few sightings on known points.
Just something to know about for those who still rely upon these paleolithic navigation devices.

Edited by - on

dcicirelli
Deckhand

Members Avatar

USA
9 Posts

Response Posted - 01/11/2009 : 07:28:16

I have found that good "enough" sound comes mostly from having a good system to connect the speakers to. That includes wiring to the speakers. I agree with the comment that most speakers are good enough I bought a pair of off brand box speakers and have been very pleased with them, but I also put in what I think is a high end CD stereo unit from a local Scratch & Dent boat store. The store is called flounder pounder and is geared towards motor boats but the guy has some neat stuff that he will ship anywhere. He may have speakers that will work. What ever you use I would expect to replace them every five years or so due to moisture even if they are marine type, so I think your thoughts about not cutting hole are on target. You want to make them as easy as possible to remove and replace as you can. If your like me you'll want them somewhere else next time...Here is the link I mentioned
http://www.fpmarine.com/ Look under electronics.
FYI...I have no affiliation wit this guy

Dave

Edited by - on

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 01/11/2009 : 10:38:57

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Voyager
 Speakers have magnets and magnets will generally affect your compass.
...
Just something to know about for those who still rely upon these paleolithic navigation devices.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Boy, could this thread take an interesting mid-winter turn.

Edited by - on

panhead1948
Captain

Members Avatar

345 Posts

Response Posted - 01/11/2009 : 14:27:53

I bought a set of speakers from Hamilton Marine about a year ago. They are about 4" square and water proof. The part# is PYP-MA840W for 49.99 a set. I mounted they to my stern rail facing forward. They have good sound and now I can listen to Buffet while I'm out sailing.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 01/11/2009 : 14:48:59

I have a little boom-box with detachable speakers. Cabin, cockpit, or somebody else's boat--no holes anywhere.

Edited by - on

Deric
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
408 Posts

Response Posted - 01/11/2009 : 18:51:25

Say,

I have a boom box as well. I can move it just about anywhere, including the bottom of the lake if I am careless. I enjoy the simplicity of the boombox. I have learned though that no matter how loud (powerful) my boombox, the stink pots always,, and I mean always, have a louder boombox. In fact, I often can hear their boombox blaring sounds long before I hear the sound of their motors racing at high rpms as they approach toward my sailboat. I regard the alarm to be helpful. I am sure others can attest to the same scenario.

I would have to say they have the kaboomiestbox.

Anyway, because the thread did ask about speakers, I do have one speaker in the hull pointing aft. It is attached to my marine radio.

Deric

Edited by - on

Bortiquai
1st Mate

Members Avatar

88 Posts

Response Posted - 01/11/2009 : 22:29:44

Thanks for all the opinions. I will just keep shopping. My fear with buying online (with an unknown brand/model) is some of the small "cube" style speakers I've heard sound really cheesy. But I'll keep looking, and check out some of the links/info some of you have sent.

I think I've decided I would like to put them on the bulkheads facing aft. Tucked up in the corner, and small enough so 1) you don't hit your head on them when sitting and 2) the first thing you say when you enter the cabin isn't "oh. nice speakers".

Thanks
Matt

Edited by - on

Even Chance
Captain

Members Avatar

USA
393 Posts

Response Posted - 01/12/2009 : 11:14:14

Good choice, Matt. I can't imagine buying speakers without listening to them. As for the cubes -- in home audio, those are almost always dependent upon a subwoofer somewhere. It's just a matter of physics that you need a larger speaker to generate low frequency sound. Bookshelf speakers are always a compromise between unit size and ability to generate bass notes. Happy hunting!

Edited by - on

Prospector
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

Canada
3159 Posts

Response Posted - 01/12/2009 : 11:46:40

Do a search on Amazon as well - I think Polk Audio makes some bookshelf - sized outdoor speakers for around $100 a set.

Edited by - on

Bortiquai
1st Mate

Members Avatar

88 Posts

Response Posted - 01/12/2009 : 15:46:56

The problem I'm running into is that most of the bookshelf speakers, even the "outdoor" ones are designed for home audio, so they are all rated at 8 Ohms. I've got a Sony Marine stereo, which of course is more like a car stereo and is rated at 4 Ohms. The 4 Ohm speaker selection seems to be limited.... Oh well. I'll have to make a choice eventually...

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 01/12/2009 : 16:50:17

Bortiquai,
I still have the round, white grill, 6.5" flush mount speakers that came with my radio, a Dual MXD41, bought new early last year if I remember correctly. It has power output of 30W x 4 @ 4 ohm. The speaker output impedance is listed as 4~8 ohms. Since I used separate surface mount speakers, I have no plans to cut holes in the bulkhead or seats to install the flush mount ones. If you want them, email me and we'll talk.

Edited by - dmpilc on 01/13/2009 13:12:33

DaveR
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
2015 Posts

Response Posted - 01/13/2009 : 07:50:01

[url="http://wave.mysite.com/medium_photo_page_3.html"]This is what I did[/url]

Edited by - on

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
5408 Posts

Response Posted - 01/13/2009 : 09:24:06

The rating of 4 ohms on car and boat stereos and amplifiers means that they will not fail or overheat if you wire two speakers per side (2 on the left and 2 on the right) in parallel.

When you combine two speakers in parallel, their total impedance is divided by two, so if the stereo were expecting 8 ohms and you presented 4 ohms with parallel speakers, you could drive the outputs too hard, and risk blowing the stereo out. With 4 ohm outputs on the stereo unit, you don't have to worry about this problem.

If you only connected one speaker to each output, you would present 8 ohms to the stereo's output, and while the output would not be able to deliver its full power to the single speaker, it will not be distorted, nor should it color the sound's quality or fidelity in any way.

In Dave Robbins' pictures, it looks as though he's got a left and right pair up by the cabin bulkhead in the settees and a pair at the end of the quarterberth. Dave, were those all standard 8 ohm speakers covering the full audio range, or were the aft ones intended as woofers?

Can you vary the front to rear balance between the settee speakers and the aft ones?

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 01/13/2009 : 09:47:20

Dave, I'm curious about the water-tight case... Does that mean it's air-tight as well? Is the Dual unit OK without any ventilation--for heat or for possible condensation (on cool nights)?

Edited by - on

Bortiquai
1st Mate

Members Avatar

88 Posts

Response Posted - 01/13/2009 : 15:06:21

Bruce,
Regarding the impedance stuff...

My stereo says it's 52W x 4. I understand that to mean 4 channels, so if you were to use 4 speakers, they would not actually be in parallel, but each on it's own channel. So if I hook up an 8 Ohm speaker to it, i might not be over-driving the output, but it will be out of phase and get the chirps and clips as the volume goes up.

If I'm off on this, I've seen a few pairs of small, 8 Ohm bookshelf style speakers that sound decent and aren't too expensive. They are usually rated at around 80 watts. If the impedance isn't a concern, is the wattage?

And what about wiring 2 channels to one speaker? Would it then become like 104W x 2?

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 01/13/2009 : 17:19:42

With just my 2 speakers set up, I rarely get up above 30% volume and they will handle much more than the radio can give them. Haven't heard any chirps or clips yet.
Use the front speaker wires only, or the rear only, and fade the unused channels out completely.

Edited by - dmpilc on 01/13/2009 17:22:49

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
5408 Posts

Response Posted - 01/13/2009 : 23:02:38

BQ --
<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"> ... if you were to use 4 speakers, they would not actually be in parallel, but each on it's own channel. <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
You are correct -- each driver (Left-Front, Right-Front, Left-Rear, Right-Rear) would be driven by its own 54W driver. Because its a four ohm output driver, you could place two speakers in parallel on each output driver.

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"> . . . but it will be out of phase <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Phase is dependent on which speaker inputs the + and - driver outputs are connected to. If two speakers are nearby one another and out of phase, they will not squeak, but may cancel highs, mids or lows, depending on a variety of local factors. Always connect the + driver to the + speaker connector and - to -, just like jumping a car. If you do so, you will not get the speakers out of phase.

Finally, if you drive one speaker with two drivers, you need to make sure you guarantee that the outputs are in phase (+ to + and - to -), or else you risk creating a dead short circuit between the two drivers.

If your stereo does not have short circuit protection (crowbar), it will surely fry.

Edited by - Voyager on 01/13/2009 23:05:05

DaveR
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
2015 Posts

Response Posted - 01/14/2009 : 13:44:51

Dave B,
I've had no trouble at all with the condensation or heat. I also have a low instance of mildew/mold. I did drill a small hole in it for the remote wire the case did not allow for ...

Bruce,
I don't remember the ohms but I did make sure that they were copacetic with the stereo. And I of course do have left to right balance, as well as front to back. No subwoofer, the two triaxials mounted in the setees make the hull a subwoofer

I actually have to be careful about too much bass!
In the end though, I have to say that I like the sound of the wind and the waves more and don't use the stereo that much. Would be different if I was anchoring out more.

Edited by - DaveR on 01/15/2009 07:42:28

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 01/14/2009 : 18:14:47

Check these out, almost exactly what I'm using, surface mounted in the corners of the main bulkhead facing aft. Acoustic Audio 151's, 7" H x 5"W x 4"D, back is narrower than the front.

Edited by - dmpilc on 01/19/2009 17:56:56

Page: of 2

Topic

New Topic

Topic Locked

Printer Friendly

Jump To:

Association Forum

Notice: The advice given on this site is based upon individual or quoted experience, yours may differ.
The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.