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Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 03/02/2009 : 09:04:25

Yup--after the ethanol attracts the moisture from the air and holds it, a temperature drop causes phase separation that drops the water to the bottom of the tank, where it can get picked up by the fuel line--that's when you want the Racor.

From what I've been told, about the best bet now is to use the green stuff (Marine StaBil) and the blue stuff (Startron). For the amount of fuel you burn, it's cheap insurance.

Edited by - on

jking
Navigator

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110 Posts

Response Posted - 03/02/2009 : 12:49:51

I had a similar problem with my 2007 Honda 9.9 early last year. Bought a product at WalMart called SeaFoam--worked VERY quickly to open up the injectors, and the motor ran wellfor the rest of the season. (Spray directly into the intake, and run NEW treated fuel thru the engine simultaneously.) SeaFoam is marketed as a cleaner and stabilizer; it seemed to work well as both for me.

Edited by - on

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5378 Posts

Response Posted - 03/03/2009 : 20:56:34

Ok, I have and use the Blue stuff, I need to buy the Green stuff, and I'll check out the SeaFoam. At 0.75 Gal/hour, I cannot complain one bit especially if the engine keeps idling.

Edited by - on

Sloop Smitten
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1181 Posts

Response Posted - 03/03/2009 : 21:34:12

Seafoam will also attack any carbon deposits you have in your cylinders if you follow their directions for pouring it into your carb. It will also blow all of those deposits onto the surface of the water (

) so make sure you don't do it in front of the local harbor patrol or lake sheriff.

Edited by - on

JJM
Navigator

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USA
170 Posts

Response Posted - 03/05/2009 : 15:44:49

There is a little twistie valve thing imbedded inside the screw top of the the fuel tank (how technical....!) . Make sure that it is 'open' as it is an air inlet valve, and in the closed position no gas will get to your engine.

Edited by - on

kbq
1st Mate

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USA
99 Posts

Response Posted - 03/08/2009 : 18:49:41

Well.

With the help of Sea Foam, I got the low speed/idle jets working. In neutral I can get high RPMs - carefully - but not at all in gear. I suspect the high speed jet/s are clogged.

Searching the 'net, it seems there are *no* carb rebuild kits available online. Anyone have a link, or am I gonna have to go to a dealer? I can find *parts* at boats.net, but no kits - and then, for my serial number, there's at least two carbs listed (auto and manual).

Any advice?

Thanks --

Kevin
wait for me
250wk

Edited by - on

bren737
Captain

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291 Posts

Response Posted - 03/08/2009 : 20:03:08

Kevin,

SeaFoam is definitely 'tha bomb', as my son would say. I run it in my old VW Beetle and she purrs; my boat's diesel, likewise.

When I had my Honda 9.9 I ordered all of my parts from Harrison Equipment in California: http://www.harrisonsequipment.com/

I usually called them to order. Very helpful, knowledgeable and reasonably priced. It helps if you go to Honda Marine http://www.honda-marine.com/ first and find the actual Honda part number but it's not necessary.

Edited by - bren737 on 03/08/2009 20:07:33

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5378 Posts

Response Posted - 03/08/2009 : 20:51:39

Kevin --
I also could not find the parts online. I looked up my nearest Honda dealer (about 12 miles away) and asked him to order the parts. I checked my Shop Manual and got the part numbers, which I double checked with the dealer. All the gaskets and O-rings fit perfectly.

Edited by - on

islander
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4024 Posts

Response Posted - 03/09/2009 : 12:36:20

You can try this for on-line parts http://www.boats.net/ OOPS I just re- read the posts and see that you already tried this site. Sorry. My bad.

Edited by - islander on 03/09/2009 12:46:00

PCP777
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1225 Posts

Response Posted - 04/07/2009 : 14:59:48

I'm hoping you guys can help as I'm a total outboard novice, I truly don't know what I don't know:

I have a 2007 Merc 9.9 that is virtually brand new with very few hours that came with my C-25 that I bought 2 months ago. It starts fine and easy on the second pull while in the Marina but on my last two sails it was really difficult to start when we were ready to come back in.

The first time I attributed it to the fact that I didn't open the vent on the gas tank. I had to try and try and finally I think I used the throttle button on the side and it finally kicked to life. We had a high pucker moment as we had doused all the sails before we had the problems starting the engine but we were able to sail out to deeper water and resolve the issue.

The second time I'm not sure, this time I did vent the gas tank. The engine starts after two pulls in the marina. We motor out of the marina just fine, turn into the wind and raise the sails. I try to shut off the outboard and I was hitting and holding the red button on the end of the throttle and it just didn't want to quit. Finally I unplugged the fuel line and it took forever to quit. ( I was told to do this when I return to the marina to run it out of gas, but should I do this while out on the lake?) I pulled her up and sailed but the prop was still a bit in the water. After about a half hour after it had quit running The engine, with fuel line unplugged and starter ositon set to off, start acting like it was running again like just ticking with no thrust. This was intermittent. Finally, when we decided the weather was just a bit more rough than we'd like, I had a very very hard time getting it to start and actually run. Once again, I had to fiddle with the throttle button on the side before it would start again.

It's getting to the point that I'm afraid to take her out as getting back to the marina would be close to impossible just under sail. I'm sure I just don't know what I don't know and maybe someone can help me, send me to an outboards for idiots site or maybe I do have a problem with this motor.

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 04/07/2009 : 17:05:45

If you got any kind of shellac-like smell when you tried to start it after laying up over the winter, the gas left in your carb has at least partially turned to a varnish-like material. The carb will need to be taken apart and cleaned. This happened to my emergency house generator.
now i try to run it regularly.

Edited by - dmpilc on 04/07/2009 17:06:38

PCP777
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1225 Posts

Response Posted - 04/07/2009 : 17:43:53

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by dmpilc
 If you got any kind of shellac-like smell when you tried to start it after laying up over the winter, the gas left in your carb has at least partially turned to a varnish-like material. The carb will need to be taken apart and cleaned. This happened to my emergency house generator.
now i try to run it regularly.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I don't think that's the case, in Texas we really don't have much of a winter lay up period and the former owner always ran the gas out of the motor by disconnecting the line when she came back to the dock and letting her run out. She has no problem starting whenever we want to take her out, it's the bringing her in that's the problem, now twice in a row.

Edited by - on

Kendall
Navigator

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USA
146 Posts

Response Posted - 04/07/2009 : 20:08:26

Ive used seafoam before. I cleans out the carbon deposits from an engine with over 60,000 miles. It did wonders for my '98 with 150,000 Available at autozone or other stores for cheap. I see no reason it shouldn't work on an outboard, but then again, a boat's engine is very different from a car's. Ask your mechanic to be sure.

Whoops didn't realize the question had been answered, maybe this information will be useful anyway.

Edited by - Kendall on 04/07/2009 20:10:06

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3758 Posts

Response Posted - 04/08/2009 : 10:04:03

The "ticking means it is probably still in gear and the moving water is spinning the prop and possibly pumping fuel&air through the engine and fouling the plugs. It won't start in gear, so be sure it is in neutral. If the shift linkage is poorly adjusted, it may be difficult to get it into neutral, but that is also unlikely on a newer engine. It also will not start if switch for the "kill Switch lanyard" is in the "On" position with no lanyard attached. The only differences between "in the marina" and after sailing" are bouncing, heeling, and water. If the carb or fuel filter were clogged by stirred up debris, it wouldn't start the next time at the marina. A worn valve seat in the carb bowl could allow the bowl to drain, but a couple of pumps of the fuel line bulb woud fix that. It would take waves energetic enough to notice to get water under the hood and short the ingition and the plug leads are new enough to not be sensitive to spray. I would be surprised if you have a mechanical problem. You first need to be sure that your start sequence is exactly the same in both situations. Do you have the owner's manual? Check at Mercury's web site if you don't. If you can't get a free one, I can scan relevent parts of mine. Mercury doesn't use model years, so an engine made in 2007 is the same as a 2006 or 2008 unless it is a new model line. Mine is a Bigfoot, but the powerhead and shift linkage are the same.
edit: send me an email if you need the manual

Edited by - Dave5041 on 04/08/2009 10:06:38

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3758 Posts

Response Posted - 04/08/2009 : 10:19:46

If the stop button really doesn't work, it should be addressed. It could just be mild corrosion if the p.o. didn't use it and just ran the engine out of gas, or the engine could have had a significant event iin its past. There is no reason to run the engine dry when it gets regular use.

Edited by - on

pastmember
Master Marine Consultant

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2402 Posts

Response Posted - 04/08/2009 : 10:23:41

Take someone with you from your marina. See what they think. As for the Marina good, on the water bad thing... well duh, an OB can't cause you grief until it is out on the water... so they wait.

Edited by - on

PCP777
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1225 Posts

Response Posted - 04/08/2009 : 10:26:23

Thanks guys. I think I have a copy of the manual, I'm almost sure it's something that I'm doing wrong. I'm going to take her out again and if it happens again I'm going to get someone to look at it.

I really appreciate everyone who has taken the time to respond thus far.

Edited by - on

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 04/08/2009 : 10:26:35

I've had good luck using Seafoam as well in my Mercedes & Ford diesels. I've yet to put it into my VW diesel, but it's only two years old. I'm pretty sure I ran it into my old Johnson OB that came with SL, but not positive. I have yet to use it in my Tohatsu, which is due for it's first service I think.

All my "won't start" problems with my Tohatsu have been user errors, usually not getting it quite into neutral, or in one case over-pumping the bulb forcing gas past the seals & hydrolocking the cylinders.

I've also forgotten to open the vent on the gas tank once with the Johnson, it died midway down the fairway, which was fun. Fortunately I figured it out quickly, but I'm sure my sister's heart was beating a bit faster than normal. We were backing down the fairway when it happened, and you can't let go of the tiller, or it slams to the side and the boat instantly veers off course. I handed her the tiller (Rita was still up on the foredeck tending lines & fenders), and told her to not hit anything. Fortunately it started right up after a couple of pumps on the bulb.

Edited by - on

PCP777
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1225 Posts

Response Posted - 05/05/2009 : 14:27:28

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by PCP777
 Thanks guys. I think I have a copy of the manual, I'm almost sure it's something that I'm doing wrong. I'm going to take her out again and if it happens again I'm going to get someone to look at it.

I really appreciate everyone who has taken the time to respond thus far.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

So guys, after having it fail to start again I had it looked at. Turns out a pin had fallen out of my choke. $112 dollars later and it's started on the first pull every time. The sailing and the peace of mind of knowing the motor will start to get me back to my slip is well worth the money even though they did charge the crud out of me for labor.

Edited by - on

Deric
Captain

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USA
408 Posts

Response Posted - 05/05/2009 : 18:10:04

hmmm,

I have a 1978 Chrysler motor, and it runs very poorly. I have ordered new spark plug wires, manual, and a carb rebuild kit. Just when I was ready to splash,, I started the motor and heard the same problems I had last season.

It wouldn't idle, it would sound like it was skipping,,I remember having to keep putting the motor in neutral in order to slow down and keep the motor running. Not a safe thing to do. I am not going another season playing chicken in a sailboat.

A marina I requested to work on it over the winter did a poor job or didn't do it at all; that is another story.

Its a 2 stroke and three years ago it ran fine; now it is temperamental.
The parts should arrive on Thursday, which leaves me all weekend to work on it.

Sometimes I am envious of the other sailors who have motors that are so quite, they hum along, no fuss.... sigh!

Deric

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 05/05/2009 : 19:37:34

Hi Peter... Perhaps you've already concluded this (from your experiences), but whether it's working nicely or not, I recommend lowering and starting the engine before you drop your sails. Most times, it can help you stay head-to-wind at least for dropping the main, but best of all, with the engine started and running, you can do everything at a relaxed pace.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 05/05/2009 : 19:48:04

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Deric
 Sometimes I am envious of the other sailors who have motors that are so quite, they hum along, no fuss.... sigh!<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Deric, just 18 little Boat Units (or whatever our association discount ends up being) and you can be in 4-stroke heaven too!

Edited by - on

PCP777
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1225 Posts

Response Posted - 05/06/2009 : 09:42:29

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Dave Bristle
 Hi Peter... Perhaps you've already concluded this (from your experiences), but whether it's working nicely or not, I recommend lowering and starting the engine before you drop your sails. Most times, it can help you stay head-to-wind at least for dropping the main, but best of all, with the engine started and running, you can do everything at a relaxed pace.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Terrific advice, I learned that the hard way on our first sail, I was close to the marina entrance and had lowered all my sails just to discover that my engine wasn't going to start. So real quickly I had to undo the sail ties and raise the main again (and the sail was getting stuck on the track but I finally got it raised)so that I could get out of traffic and get away from land and out to deeper water and sail around for a while until I finally got it to start. It was a high pucker moment as we were very close to land. From that day on, I get the engine started before I ever lower my sails. Much safer and more relaxed.

Edited by - on

Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3704 Posts

Response Posted - 05/06/2009 : 13:08:26

Edited by - on

Deric
Captain

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USA
408 Posts

Response Posted - 05/06/2009 : 17:05:25

Dave,

hahahah four stroke heaven? ok,, let's get the crowd going again: Honda or Tohatsu: which is better?....... just kidding. We have a thread on that topic already.

Deric

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