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Rebedding deadlights

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fpill
1st Mate

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USA
51 Posts

Initially Posted - 03/08/2009 : 19:11:49

I decided to try and replace the deadlights today.

The P.O.left the Aluminum Window Reseal Kit C-25, C-27, without the adhesive/caulk. So I bought two 10 oz tubes of Lifeseal.

I started by taking out the aft, port side deadlight in the salon.

Upon removing it, I noticed that the wood around the edge was shredded and still damp. This is after having the tarp on all winter.

I removed some material as mentioned in Don Casey's Sailboat Maintenance Manual pg 158-160

I'm going to fill with epoxy, but should I try to dry out the rest of the wood? If yes, How? Will it dry on its own once I epoxy over it and no more water gets in? (I hope no more water gets in)

Another thing I noticed is that my deadlights are glass not any type of plastic. Should I use something besides lifeseal?

In Casey's book it mentions polysulfide if there is no plastic, but from reading other posts in this forum I would guess I still should use Lifeseal.

Sorry, I know you can't read the words.

Thanks
Frank

Frank
1978 C25 #488
SR/WK
West Islip, NY

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Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5368 Posts

Response Posted - 03/08/2009 : 21:20:22

Frank --
you could do a few things:
> dig down to dry core wood. Don Casey recommends using a bent finishing nail in the drill chuck (as a router) to clear out the wet wood
> some folks have used "Git Rot" to kill off any rot in the coring.
> acetone will help dry materials out - when acetone evaporates, it carries off water too.
> some folks use a hairdryer for a long - long - long time
> others just wait for the material to dry out.

Replace the removed core with a mixture of thickened epoxy (using micro-bubbles or talc) to fill and seal the void. Once cured, fair the edge and re-install the windows. According to previous posts, you should replace the seals with those supplied in the kit from Catalina Direct.

Since the lights are held in with screws and frames, it may be ok to use silicone. According to Casey, if the windows are held in mechanically, and you are not relying on the silicone for adhesion, silicone may be fine, provided it is clamped in place. If there's any chance the windows will move (heating and cooling), don't use silicone.

If there is any chance the windows will move or shift, then polysulfide will remain flexible enough. It provides some adhesion so that gaps should not develop inside the frames, and allow drips.

Edited by - on

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3758 Posts

Response Posted - 03/09/2009 : 00:22:22

I use polysulfide whenever possible and have never regretted it. I think the CD kit has 5200 for the frames, and I think that could be a very bad idea down the road. Silicone does have an application here for the vinyl gasket surfaces to the frame and the glass.

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farrison
Navigator

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USA
166 Posts

Response Posted - 03/09/2009 : 09:52:15

The CD kit includes an excellant Dow/Corning product called '795' for the glass-to-seal and seal-to-frame. The kit has 4200UV, not 5200 for the frame-to-cabin application.

You can read my recent write-up in the Mainsheet on window re-sealing. More information was going to go into the Tech Tips section, but I don't think it's been put in yet.

Paul

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delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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4479 Posts

Response Posted - 03/09/2009 : 10:55:12

Frank,
If you epoxy over the damp wood, you'll likely accelerate the next time you need to do this repair. I inadvertently did this on my tiller, three coats of epoxy followed by three of Cetol sealed in the water that had penetrated the laminations. A number of freeze/thaw cycles along with dry rot, and the next time I flexed the tiller handle hard, it snapped off in my hand. However, even if I'd have known about the water, I'm not sure what I would have done about it. But I'll be engineering my new tiller to avoid all of this. There's nothing like having the last foot of your tiller break off in your hands when you've got people who've never been sailing before on board with you. I tried to be calm about it, and head in w/o alarming anyone. Fortunately it was a somewhat calm day and we got in w/o incident.

Acetone is a good idea, MEK will work as well and stays "wet" longer, but I personally hate MEK (used to be occupationally exposed a long time ago, ugh).

Git Rot or other similar thinned epoxy products will also work, but if you're already got dry rot going (and it looks like you may), I'd remove as much of the compromised material as I could & then build it back up as suggested with fairing putty.

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fpill
1st Mate

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USA
51 Posts

Response Posted - 03/09/2009 : 18:15:40

Thanks for the suggestions:

Bruce: I'm going to use acetone or MEK to dry out the wood the best I can.
Then I'll use the Git-Rot or something like it to seal and strengthen the wood. I see there is another product called CPES has anyone used that instead of Git-Rot?
I'm having a problem figuring how to soak the wood above the opening with something that non-viscous.

Dave B: I'm leaning toward using lifeseal. From my reading it should be flexible and be a good adhesive for the frames to the fiberglass. If others feel that lifecaulk would be a better solution please let my know why.

Paul: Which issue of Mainsheet? Is there a way to get back issues, or as a member can I see back issues online?

David: I know what you mean about the MEK. I've used Methylene Chloride for extractions and formaldehyde in electroless copper plating. Then I decided to change careers.
What do you mean by fairing putty?
I was going to soak the wood in MEK or Acetone. Use Git-Rot to harden the wood, and then a thicker epoxy (West System)to fill in the void. Please tell my if this doesn't seem right.

Thanks again,
Frank

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delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 03/09/2009 : 19:28:17

I make fairing putty with West System epoxy & 410 or 407 fillers (check their website for the best filler to use for your application).

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farrison
Navigator

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USA
166 Posts

Response Posted - 03/10/2009 : 11:24:04

The write-up on the window re-seal is in the latest issue that came out in Feburary. It's in the tech section in the back of the issue. Or you can e-mail me and I'll send you a copy of what I submitted.

Paul

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Patrice C25
1st Mate

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78 Posts

Response Posted - 03/10/2009 : 12:06:24

Hi,

Just one thing, when you'll replace the frame with the screws. Put the sealant you'll have choosen, preferably something like 3M-4200, do not thingten completely the screws. Let the sealant dry, like 24hours, then finish thingthen the screws. This will prevent the sealant from comming out at some place and prevent futur leaking and will form what you want, a good gasket.

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fpill
1st Mate

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USA
51 Posts

Response Posted - 03/12/2009 : 17:53:36

Thanks for all of the suggestions. Now I've got work to do.
Frank

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