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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

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It must be the economy

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britinusa
Web Editor

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USA
5404 Posts

Initially Posted - 12/05/2009 : 14:11:12

I know that we were out 'Thursday' and 'Friday' (ok, so we returned on Friday) but WOW, no boats!

Black Point Marina has the ability to park a couple of hundred truck and trailers.

When we launched JD on Thursday, we were the only truck and trailer in the parking lot!!!!
We only saw 2 boats on the water on Thursday, and another 6 on Friday..

Just to give a baseline, this time last year there were probably a hundred trailers in the parking lot on the Friday. Go back 2 years and on a Friday there would barely be room to park.

The upside is the complete availability of ramps.
The downside is that the marinas must be hurting real bad.

Paul

Joint Decision. (Sold)
PO C250WB 2005 Sail # 841.

Moved up to C34 Eximius

Updated August 2015

Edited by - on

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 12/05/2009 : 14:45:15

Meybe they got better weather forecasts??????

Edited by - on

Rich P
1st Mate

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USA
77 Posts

Response Posted - 12/05/2009 : 15:32:13

Up here it's called December, although I was out flying a few days ago and saw one sailboat, 3 powerboats, 3 or 4 fishing boats and a ferry throughout the entire bay system.

Edited by - on

OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 12/05/2009 : 19:33:16

I sold my 1981 C25 about four years ago and later lost interest in this site. Now that I'm acquiring another round of boat equipment I've begun perusing the questions and contrbutions found here again. Compared to four or so years ago, I see a dramatic drop in forum traffic. Some may have become saturated with the topic while others moved on to larger or different or even no boats. It is also a little depressing to see all the Catalina 25s across the country that have been listed on Craigslist - and then later relisted a second or third time for a lower price, e.g., a 1989 wing keel with trailer and 4-stroke outboard for $8,500! When 1981 models do sell, it's for about half what I sold mine for. I may well get a dock space in one year that used to take two or three. I've been looking for a whisker pole for my new-to-me 89 C25 wing keel and a sail kit for a Walker Bay dinghy. I find the most listings for these two items in Florida - by a large margin. Draw your own conclusion.

Edited by - OJ on 12/06/2009 01:15:31

britinusa
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USA
5404 Posts

Response Posted - 12/05/2009 : 19:41:22

Glad you are back onboard OJ.

Dock space / hard space is also becoming available sooner down here too. But then the price of the slips and hard are getting way up there. Supply & Demand I guess.

Paul

Edited by - on

islander
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4024 Posts

Response Posted - 12/06/2009 : 10:50:17

You are probably right. Boats and there accompanying costs are an extra. When things start getting tight, The extras are the first thing to go. The slip next to me in my marina has been empty now for the past two summers and a few more scattered about were empty all summer too. The guy down at WM says that business has been horrible, and boat shows have a lot of lookers but not many buyers. Depressing to say the least.

Edited by - on

bigelowp
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1793 Posts

Response Posted - 12/06/2009 : 15:56:36

There sure appears to be a glut of boats on the used market -- of all types/sizes/mfgs -- but the older (over ten years) seem to be especially available. I think that the interest is not any less by those who own their boat, but the demands at work maybe greater and the willingness to tackle (e.g. spend those renegade peso's on) projects more thoughtfully considered than a couple of years back. In the summer of 2008 there was a notable decrease of boats -- specifically power boats -- on my area of western Long Island Sound. I figures because of the cost of gas/diesel and the contracting economy. This past year and especially the fall months the traffic was pretty brisk.

Edited by - on

Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3758 Posts

Response Posted - 12/06/2009 : 19:19:42

A numer of boats in our marina spent the summer on cradles. An owner a few slips down from me wanted to sell his beautiful Pearson 26 so he could buy a Bristol 28 that needed work; over the summer he dropped the price to $2000 with a cradle with no takers. I vaguely considered buying it at that price to keep boats in Florida and Ohio and stop towing.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 12/06/2009 : 20:44:43

None of this can be a surprise... Boat builders disappear in each one of these downturns, and this is one of the worst. Used boat inventories go through the roof, and marinas end up with boats on the hard for a few years, with unpaid yard bills, that go into foreclosure to a bank and leave the marina "high and dry". Tough business, and a huge buyer's market. We can be thankful that Catalina has weathered many of these storms--the builder of one of my earlier boats, O'Day, didn't. As has been attested to many times here, having the manufacturer around and willing to support owners, even of much older boats, is solid gold!

Edited by - Dave Bristle on 12/06/2009 20:46:01

DaveR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2015 Posts

Response Posted - 12/07/2009 : 09:20:33

Not withstanding what's been said, I think the Marina was mostly empty partly because of the weather system that was forecast to come in. We had quite the windy and rainy week-end throughout the state of Florida (except not sure about the panhandle).

Edited by - on

bigelowp
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1793 Posts

Response Posted - 12/08/2009 : 20:44:51

It will be interesting which mfgs are unable to survive this downturn -- and I agree fully Amen for Catalina's perseverence over so many downturns and the continued support to us all!

It appears that that pricing for 25's is down @$2k from 07 and for the C-30 almost $4k -- all do to supply.

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 12/09/2009 : 06:34:05

With things they way the are, on the used boat market you can probably get a "buy one get one free" deal.

Edited by - dlucier on 12/09/2009 06:34:20

NautiC25
Admiral

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USA
957 Posts

Response Posted - 12/09/2009 : 07:24:41

I thought I got a good deal on my 89 back in June, but I looked at Craigslist recently and OMG! I saw a C30 for $12k and 30'+ fixer uppers for $10-20k. C25's, even the 87+ models are $5k and under.
I just wish I could find a trailer locally for cheap.

I've gone to the lake the past two weekends, even though it's been cold, and LOVED it. All the summer boaters are gone, so it's dead out there. No more waverunners flying by me at 60mph, cigarette boats causing huge wakes.... It's perfect.

Edited by - on

Elliott
Deckhand

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18 Posts

Response Posted - 12/14/2009 : 13:32:24

We have the Sugar Bowl Regatta this weekend, and I'll try to remember to post how many boats we get for that. Last night was the Christmas Boat Parade, but my wife and I had prior plans this year, but I heard there were a lot of boats out (with some nice decorations.)

Edited by - on

Elliott
Deckhand

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18 Posts

Response Posted - 12/29/2009 : 11:47:33

I forgot to post an update. For the Sugar Bowl Regatta, we had 14 spinnaker boats and 4 non-spinnaker. The boats that were out all seemed like they had really experienced, regular crews, except for two: my boat and the only boat I beat. I was in Spinnaker C. In my class, one boat dropped out, so I placed higher than him, but I never beat him. The one race he completed, he was faster than me. In Spinnaker B, there was a J30 that was having a rough couple of days. The first day, they beat us across the line both races, but we ranked better based on PHRF. The second day was only one race, and we actually crossed the line well ahead of them.

Complete results are at the New Orleans Yacht Club website: http://noyc.org .

Edited by - Elliott on 12/29/2009 11:48:47

OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 12/30/2009 : 13:38:30

Not to spread doom and gloom, but if you go to craiglook and type in "Catalina 25" you will see the beating some people are taking on their boats. The newer listings have yet to see the reality of the current market. Personal balance sheets take yet another hit!

Edited by - on

Elliott
Deckhand

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18 Posts

Response Posted - 12/31/2009 : 13:40:21

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by OJ
 Not to spread doom and gloom, but if you go to craiglook and type in "Catalina 25" you will see the beating some people are taking on their boats. The newer listings have yet to see the reality of the current market. Personal balance sheets take yet another hit!
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I wouldn't worry about it, really. A) We don't intend to sell ours. B) It's winter; boats are always cheaper in the winter.

Edited by - on

Arlyn Stewart
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2980 Posts

Response Posted - 12/31/2009 : 14:39:32

Nothing to add, other than I found the thread interesting.

Edited by - on

Peregrine
Admiral

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830 Posts

Response Posted - 12/31/2009 : 14:53:22

Glass half empy, glass half full.

I got [url="http://www.catalina-capri-25s.com/photo/peregrine2.jpg"]"Peregrine" ('85 C-25 SR #4762)[/url]for 7K 10 years ago which was a tremendous deal. But I may not be able to get that for her now.
I am thankful that I decided awhile ago to stay with the C-25 and not move up.
[url="http://www.catalina-capri-25s.com/photo/peregrine2.jpg"]"Peregrine"[/url] is in good shape and with the costs of keeping any boat going up all the time the C-25 is affordable and a great boat to sail.
I see plenty of bigger boats with costs that are out stripping the ability of their owners to keep up.

I'm happy to stay with the C-25 and extend my time sailing for as long as possible.

Underlined words are HOT links.

Edited by - Peregrine on 12/31/2009 15:03:04

Arlyn Stewart
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2980 Posts

Response Posted - 01/01/2010 : 05:00:41

After sleeping and thinking about the comments in this thread, a couple of comments might be applicable. A few of you know that I've not been sailing in several years though I still have my boat. There are several reasons, most of my sailing had evolved to a summer Great Lakes cruise and the poor health of a mother in law, the employee that allowed me to easily take time off left my employment, gas prices for the haul from Texas to the Great Lakes and some diminishing funds as I elected at age 55 to scale back my business and not push it so hard. Also locally, the Corp Lake was too low for several years to sail.

To fill the void, I got back involved in RC airplanes as it was local and I still knew many of the guys from previous years.

That hobby/sport also is down in activity since I got back into it in 2001. Our membership is about half, from 75 to 35 and the flying field though still fairly busy, doesn't reach the bustle of activity that existed in 2001.

While it is hard to be precise about the reasons, economics might be at play as well as availability of leisure time or the mix of those. One flier has curtailed much of his activity because in his seventies after being retired for several years, he went back to work out of a need to augment the family budget.

Another factor is attrition, less newbies compared to those either passing on or growing too old to stay active.

Another issue is competition... some have burned out and moved on to the next adventure.

Time has a way of changing the landscape... and sometimes it cycles... and sometimes the crescendo never returns... who knows the future?

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 01/01/2010 : 11:24:09

Musings on a gray, damp New Years Day... It's strange to think of the inventor of "Arlyn's Soft-Link", and the guru of C-250 rudders and steering systems, not sailing! But things do change.

Things changed for me when my First Mate (aka Admiral) succumbed to cancer six years ago today... I've never gotten much satisfaction from doing things by and for myself, alone. It was rare that somebody had the time and interest to go sailing with me, and often that didn't coincide with the right weather... Passage sat forlornly in her slip for one summer in Darien, CT, and then for two more at a marina in Mystic--rarely getting out.

Meanwhile, the little center-console I bought for the slip at my condo was attracting plenty of interest--walk outside, down to the dock, slip the lines, and head down the river past the historic seaport, through the village, and out to Fisher's Island, Watch Hill, the Groton sub base, or other interesting places. So I consolidated the fleet--now the boat outside my door, Sarge, can take my new companion and me on overnights to Watch Hill, Block Island, Shelter Island, the CT River, and beyond--almost regardless of the weather. A rainy day can be delightful out there! (Click on the signature photo and notice the windshield wipers.) She "sleeps two, parties ten."

For the sheer joy of playing with the wind, the Mystic Seaport has a fleet of Beetle Cats and assorted other little craft that I can use to harass passing powerboats (like myself).

The glass is full.

Edited by - on

Arlyn Stewart
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2980 Posts

Response Posted - 01/02/2010 : 08:26:24

Ahh Time,

Hi Dave... gosh we go back a way.

Your post was a good piece of writing with lots of meanings and feelings.

My last cruise was in 2003. A 2004 was planned for Lake Superior and Isle Royal but had to be canceled and that set the stage for a continued stream of non sailing summers almost now as many as were cruised in a row.

The hope remains to resume so R&R has been kept in good shape and a few upgrades even added yet to be enjoyed. Who knows tomorrow?

The semi retirement that has been enjoyed, is a little restrictive in that while not much effort is needed, what is... is critical and cramps hitting the road to where I want to cruise.

Time has a way, its way. I've not heard a word for several years from the Paysons. Herb and Nancy had acquired a C250 and trailer cruised the West writing a few articles about those experiences but their voices have dimmed, though I see Herb has a web site that sells his books.

Another mate in your life is a product of time as well as it was for me.

Best wishes for the new year and new decade...

Last... we each have a short list of persons we've come to know about and would like to meet... you've been on my list for some time.

Edited by - on

frankr
Captain

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256 Posts

Response Posted - 01/03/2010 : 07:38:03

My status has changed - retirement - We sold the C36 last July - (It was an upgrade from the C250 we started with in 2003). We lived 4.25 hours from the boat (one way) and had no hope of relocating closer with the current housing market. After doing the math the - cost of maintaining and using the boat exceeded the cost of maintaining our home. So We down sized to a 19 foot Flying Scot which I can keep in the driveway and town about 20 minutes to the local lake. Yes it isn't the same as the Chesapeake but it is affordable and it keeps me sailing. Also the systems are much simplier to maintain and keepup. I dearly miss the Chesapeake but reality needs to be considered sometimes.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 01/03/2010 : 10:12:03

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Arlyn Stewart
 ...we each have a short list of persons we've come to know about and would like to meet... you've been on my list for some time.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Likewise.

Frank: I love the Flying Scot--performs like a Laser but has room for company! You can even drop her into the Severn, Miles, Choptank, Chester, or wherever and enjoy some of the best of the Chesapeake!

Edited by - on

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