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Bimini The Cloth not the island

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Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Initially Posted - 07/20/2010 : 11:38:48

Last week it was hot. So hot in fact that we deemed that all other hotter than a #### and hot as !@@@@ no longer qualified. This heat was worse than all those. As one might have guessed, a good portion of that heat came from this odd lookin orange ball in the sky. I am now officially on the market for a bimini. Since this year a new traveler was purchased, and next year it is a furler and sail augmentation the only way to cram this into the budget is to do it myself. I'll probably fab something up from or get a kit from Sail Rite, but am curious about a few things. In no particular order they are -

How many cross bars are the norm on a similar 30 foot boat.3,4 more?
How do people deal with the aft stay? I know that you can cut it in and use velcro, but what about when you don't have it expanded. Does it just sit against the back stay? I think that would be in the way of my wheel? Are there other ways to deal with this.

Are they easy to take off while racing?

What else do I need to know?

D. Wolff
DPO C25 Hull 401
Currently Sailing "Champagne and Ripple" 1982 O'day 30

Chief Measurer 2002-2006
Vice-commodore 2007

Edited by - Champipple on 07/20/2010 16:21:43

redeye
Master Marine Consultant

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Response Posted - 07/21/2010 : 11:30:44

Not that I've done it yet, but I'm planning on using an old spanker off a smaller sailboat I usta have, an old wooden Chesapeake bay sharpie.

After I add a topping lift, I thought I'd clip the top of the spanker to the topping lift after raising the boom up, and tie the bottom of the sail to the stays, port and strbrd. I'd like to add flag halyards to the midstays to raise this sail. I've got one pole on board to widen the foot of this sail. Again, this is all in my mind, but I have the materials, and it is just one option for me to look at.

I have a warped mind, so I thought I'd raise a warped sail.

The previous owner had canvas on board and two poles, but they took up a lot of room in storage, and I never used it.

Edited by - on

Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 07/21/2010 : 12:38:14

I'm not sure flag halyards would handle that load Ray. Additionally, I'm not sure there's enough space for a spanker...Maybe I am not visualizing it correctly but isn't there a gaff and a boom involved with a spanker.

Any input on my Bimini Question?

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9089 Posts

Response Posted - 07/21/2010 : 13:21:10

I didn't have a wheel, but I used two telescoping struts in place of the rear straps. (See below.) The purpose was to hold the folded bimini in an upright position (leaning aft) when folded, where it was no more of an obstruction than the main bow is when it's deployed. The black knobs let you adjust the length, and thereby the angle and tension. I attached the struts to the sternrail with two clamp-on "bases". I was planning on adding quick-release pins or thumb-screws for the struts so the whole thing could be easily dropped forward on the cabintop. The same for the main bow bases could make the whole thing easily removable--if you have a place to leave it. (It's pretty big!)

Here's the clamp-on base:

On a C-25, we generally don't worry about the backstay because we have to keep the bimini forward of the mainsheet. With mid-boom sheeting, the bimini goes further aft and the backstay becomes a potential issue. I don't know how many larger biminis have more than one bow between the main bows--you might want to look around your marina.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">What else do I need to know?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Oh my......

Well, make sure the placement doesn't interfere with the sheets leading to the winches and such...

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 07/21/2010 13:39:33

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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4593 Posts

Response Posted - 07/23/2010 : 06:17:55

3 bow bimini. If you use spring-loaded quick release pins at the mounting points, removal for racing is very easy. Leave it laying on your dock.

Found this pic:
http://www.sailboatlistings.com/view/15997

http://www.sailboatlistings.com/view/18385

Edited by - dmpilc on 07/23/2010 06:28:02

Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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6855 Posts

Response Posted - 07/23/2010 : 07:31:24

David,

Not sure where you found the o'day pic with a Bimini. I looked for a long time you must have spent a lot of time. ....The first one you list is a near identical version of my boat only the year is off. Second one not so much.

The first pic looks like a 2 bow version though? One issue I see is that both of these guys only have one set of cockpit winches, we have two. The mounting point in on the top of the coaming looks like it would hit the secondary grinders.

When looking at the other pics for the second boat - I can see it is a three bow with the smaller middle bow one coming off of the aft bow. Can you discern if the supports that are on the aft end and connecting to the pulput acual pipes or are they straps? The port side looks like metal, the starboard looks like a strap?

Next question - boat two - this boat has more pics so it is giving me a number of ideas. Is the aft bow behind the aft-stay? I could see some pros and cons with that.

Last question - does it look to you like the second boat has messed with the main in order to sail with the bimini out. The one picture ad the dock looks like they jacked it up a bit.

Thanks - this is helping immensely. I have a line on an inexpensive yet good quality bimini fabbed for a power boat. Right now the width measurement works. I have to see about the height for the boom.

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9089 Posts

Response Posted - 07/23/2010 : 10:11:07

Regarding height, most can be shortened somewhat by cutting the bottoms of the main bow. On that second boat, it could be shortened by as much as about 6". I ordered mine a little tall so I could decide the exact height when I got it to the boat.

Edited by - on

Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 07/23/2010 : 11:02:12

Cool - that's good to know...

By the way, if there isn't anything wrong with the O'day 30 - that is a great price. It is about half of what it should be worth

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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5909 Posts

Response Posted - 07/23/2010 : 16:23:46

Duane, the bimini on my boat has 3 bars. The longest bar leans aft of the backstay; the next longest bar is attached to the first bar, and it leans forward; the third bar is rather short, and it is attached higher up on the first bar, and it leans forward, to support the fabric between the two longer bars. The fabric cover is cut to allow the backstay to pass through, and it has a zipper. The longest bar should be long enough so that you can stand comfortably behind the wheel while steering.

When racing, I collapse the bimini against the backstay and put a zippered cover on it. Alternatively, you could either remove just the fabric (leaving the bare bars lashed to the backstay), or you could completely remove the entire structure, including the bars and the fabric, but the windage it creates when collapsed in any of those ways is nominal, and I wouldn't bother to remove either the fabric or the structure.

In this hot @##&***@@ weather, the bimini is a pleasure. When it's deployed, it impedes your view of the sails and telltales, etc., but when you're cruising or daysailing, that's not nearly so important as having shelter from the sun. You could put a small window in the bimini to let you see the sails a little better, for sail trimming purposes, but that would defeat the purpose of the bimini. When I'm sailing under a bimini, I don't feel that I have to slather so much sunscreen on me, although I generally wear a long-sleeved Underarmour tech shirt, so I don't have to use sunscreen on my arms.

Edited by - Steve Milby on 07/23/2010 16:58:08

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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4593 Posts

Response Posted - 07/25/2010 : 05:14:56

Actually, I didn't have to look too long, just Googled "Oday 30". I didn't like the 2-bow on the first boat. OUr boat has a 3-bow bimini. On the second boat, the bimini appears to be attached to the stern rail with solid struts, so it would be stored up against the backstay when not in use. It does look like it goes around the backstay, probably does have a zipper in the fabric. I wonder if the aft bow has a coupler that opens up to bring the aft bow forward of the backstay for installation/removal.
Don't know about the main. BTW, the second boat is an Oday 28, not a 30. I pulled it in because it had good bimini pics.

Edited by - dmpilc on 07/25/2010 05:31:25

Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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6855 Posts

Response Posted - 07/25/2010 : 06:47:50

I walke the docks at the club yesterday checking out various bimini's. The plan is to do a combination things discussed in this thread. I also looked at the bimini on a Jeanneau 50+ yesterday - I think I've seen space shuttles with less intricate designs.

My last concern is to be able to get the headroom I need and have it fit under the boom while deployed.

Edited by - on

Tom Potter
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1913 Posts

Response Posted - 07/25/2010 : 08:33:46

Duane,
My Bimini is rather short lengthwise and does not cover the entire cockpit which limits the shade to the helm area. Looks like the PO did this so it would clear the boom. There are struts that hold the back of the Bimini to the aft rail and I put on a "Strapless Bimini Kit" which consist of horizontal tubes and some fittings on both sides of the Bimini bows that hold the rails extended tightly. I love this set up as there are no forward straps to trip over. If your interested in the Strapless Bimini you can find the kits using google.
The Bimini stays open all the time, there are zippers so I can remove the sunbrella during big blows and winter.

Edited by - on

Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 07/25/2010 : 09:50:09

Thanks for the pics Tom. I've looked at about 250 different bimini's now on Craigs list, Ebay and everywhere else. It is probably about time to take some measurements.

Your 1 pic reminded me of another issue we are having....how's your binnacle compass holding up Tom?

Edited by - on

Tom Potter
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1913 Posts

Response Posted - 07/25/2010 : 10:04:18

Seems to be going okay. I had to add a little fluid and adjust it when I bought the boat. The PO did keep it covered so the glass and card are clear. I need to fix the little light. Keeping them covered makes the difference.

Edited by - on

Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 07/25/2010 : 11:52:36

Ours was never covered. The glass (now very yellowed) has crazing and the fluid looks low. Can't figure out where to add the fluid.

That little light is a royal pain. We taped off the terminals and stopped replacing batteries. Poor design, imo.

Edited by - on

dmpilc
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Response Posted - 01/12/2011 : 11:48:07

Duane,
Did you ever get the bimini worked out on your O'day 30?

Edited by - on

eguevara
Navigator

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USA
111 Posts

Response Posted - 03/10/2011 : 20:00:22

I have a bimini on my catalina 22 and I have come to love it.. the catalina 25 I just bought doesn't have one..
so I've been researching and I can't seem to find a bimini for less than what CD sells it..
am I right? or am I missing something?

-eddy

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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4593 Posts

Response Posted - 04/22/2011 : 15:46:21

equevara: If you don't want to buy a second bimini just buy a second set of attachment bases for the deck of the C-25. Depending on where your bimini is mounted on the C-22, you might be able to move the C-22 bimini to the C-25 easily. I did that with ours and it is a tall rig. Take the C-22 bimini to the C-25 and lay it on boat's cabintop. Where the ends of the bow touch the deck will tell you approximately where the bases will need to be mounted. Actually, I would do this with the bimini open (putting a cloth under the bow ends so you don't scratch the deck) so you can position it to avoid the mainsheet and boom vang.

We bought ours from: boatcoversdirect.com.
Good hunting.
P.S. The only downside to this is that our C-22 bimini did not mount on the coaming, but outside on the deck. Accordingly, it does make going forward more difficult.

Edited by - dmpilc on 04/22/2011 16:00:53

Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 04/25/2011 : 08:13:47

David,

We are in process right now, just waiting to step the mast and attach the boom to get the final measurements. We decided not to split the aft end fo the backstay and just run the bimini up to it. The thought being if the bimini is up we will not be racing and adjustment will not be needed. The length will be the longest they can make without splicing in additional fabric which is about 72". This gives us room to get in and out of the cockpit via the dock without having to duck in. Our estimations based on getting hitting our head on the boom is that we will be able to stand in the cockpit with it up. We are set on the 3 bow and still waivering between Aluminum or Stainless. The attach points will be detent pins so that we can 1. Move it aft of the backstay to make keep it out of the way if anchored and not in need of it (or too windy). 2. Take it off Quickly for racing.

I am looking at a place that does custom out of South Carolina because they have the best prices I've found with Sundbrella. If they work out I'll post here.

Edited by - on

Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 07/06/2011 : 06:03:39

We were able to get a bimini. The price of 0.00 boat units was right and the sunbrella was pacific blue matching all current canvas. We couldn't pass it up.

The sucker is big with 4 bows and a lot of cloth. I don't have an actual measurement, but it will cover the entire cockpit with a little overlap. We had discussed going Betsy Ross on the thing and cutting it for the backstay, but decided to put that on hold for the time being. If we put it forward of the aftstay it seems to be high enough so our heads won't hit it while stowed. We aren't entirely sure about the height of the boom, we will have to measure that under sail tonight but it will be close.

The current plan is to only use it at the dock or at anchor for the time being. This means we need a few things. 1. Support struts so that if we go for a short trip we can leave it upright and stowed. That is just a matter of buying the pipe and fittings and it should be a half day job or less. 2. Fabricate somthing on the dock so that it is secure for when we go racing and want to leave it at home. This again is a short trip just some wood, hardware and shock cord. 3. Attaching it to the boat. It is big enough to hit our jib tracks (they go all the way aft on the O'day) I'm hoping to find a way to use those tracks instead of installing more hardware in the deck. Unfortunately, the only product I've been able to find (from catalina direct) fits 1 1/8th inch t track. We have 1 1/4" tracks....

Does anyone know of a place that carries these in a larger size?

If not what do all of you think about getting some of the following and welding my own?

Edited by - on

Davy J
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1511 Posts

Response Posted - 07/06/2011 : 08:45:14

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">If not what do all of you think about getting some of the following and welding my own?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
I used something similar. I removed the u-shaped loops. There was enough room under the slide to use screws, with nuts on the underside. I may have cut the screws shorter but I don't remember.

As far as keeping the bimini out of the way when not in use I just tie it up with a shackle to the pig tail. However, my bimini only has three bows:

Edited by - on

Champipple
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
6855 Posts

Response Posted - 07/06/2011 : 12:40:47

Davy,

Just called Gary at CD (I think it was Gary), he said they don't have anything in my size but thought they might be easily weldable, however the weld would be subject to rust unless I have it re-coated. Your thought on actually using screw/nut combinations has me wondering if I could pull it off???? I can always weld the buggers but if I can do it neater and cheaper I will.

As for the pigtail - I don't have one anymore but it seems like a decent enough idea. I think that and the traveler are right up there with things I do not miss....Maybe having to duck in the cabin coming close in third.

Edited by - on

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