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Glitch at boatyard

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Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5377 Posts

Initially Posted - 10/16/2010 : 10:00:26

I received a call from the boat yard the other day. She asked me about my winter storage plans, and I mentioned I'm leaving the dock in early November for my haul-out at another yard. [They're 1/2 the price of my yard for the winter].

She said, 'ok, I'll check with the yard boss on that and get back to you'. I said, 'fine', and since we've got about 3 weeks to go, I thought nothing more about it.

Phone rang later and I saw the boatyard's ID. Wondered, 'what the heck?'

She told me 'the winter agreement states the summer season ends on Oct 23. Since you're spending two additional weeks on the dock, the fee will only be $50 a week'.

Popped my cork! In the past, summer season ended on Nov 1 so I thought my plan was cool. I composed myself and explained, 'In that case, I will be leaving on the 23rd, so don't bother sending me a bill'.

'Oh?' she said. 'Nice try', I said.

Now my haul date is set, no changing that. They've got boats stacked like cordwood waiting to be hauled, so no way can I cut the line.

I reckoned there should be no shortage of open moorings and slips elsewhere at this point in time - should have no trouble finding a spot to hang out for a few weeks. I want to stay in the Housatonic River, since my haul-out is located further upriver.

I called the town Harbormaster. Turns out, the town has a mooring ball about 200 yards off my dock in the river, clearly in view of the marina. Fee is $10.

Am I being a cheapskate? Or are they trying to nickel & dime me? They slipped in the new end date in the recent contract, while last year's summer agreement is silent on the matter.

Then there's the next summer season - I can get a floating dock in the next town for $400. Beats the fee at my marina.

For what I'll save, I can buy a nice dink.

Bruce Ross
Passage ~ SR-FK ~ C25 #5032

Port Captain � Milford, CT

Edited by - on

Tomas Kruska
Admiral

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Czech Republic
522 Posts

Response Posted - 10/16/2010 : 10:57:32

Ohh... thouhgt thah this could happen only here in post-communistic state, but you are lucky you have such big marina infrastructure there.

I suppose that you have the electricity and water included in for $400 at marina on the river.

Edited by - on

islander
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4024 Posts

Response Posted - 10/16/2010 : 12:53:28

My summer season ends on Oct 31 by contract. They don't hold me to that date because I always wintered there also. The contract does state that a charge will be imposed if you go beyond that date. My winter contract is from Nov 1 to Apr 30 (6 months or @24 weeks) and is $1222.50 . So 1222.50 Divided by 24 = $50.93 per week. I don't think they are gouging you. I pay the price at the Marina for the protection of calm waters. I don't think I could sleep at night having the boat out on a ball in the winds that we have today or the storms that we have had this past season. I also like the convenience of walking from the car to the boat and shoving off any time day or night vs having to carry the cooler from the car to the launch. Load it all on the launch then unload everything onto the boat and reverse the procedure at the end of the day. You are also tied to the launch operating times. I never had to go and throw extra lines on the boat yet this season. The Marina is that well protected and also where would you like your boat to be if we do get a Hurricane? Who do you think they are going to service first, Their customers or the outsiders. I have a town Marina a little farther into the harbor I could go to at half price but they only give you water and electric and poles to tie to,No floating docks. They also hire kids for the summer to work there and leave at 9pm leaving the boats for anybody to wander around on. They don't have a lift or mechanical and no winter storage so thats up to you if you needed service. No not for me. Are you in Brewers? Typical of them if you are on changing the dates.

Edited by - islander on 10/16/2010 13:29:29

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9081 Posts

Response Posted - 10/16/2010 : 13:45:26

$50/week doesn't sound bad--sneaking the date up sorta does... What the hell is the significance of 10/23/10 (other than my nephew's wedding)?? Will the marina where you're storing let you use an empty slip till your haul-out date? Mine will.

What do you get for that $400? That'a a remarkable number--you know what they say about "too good to be true." Sounds a little like one of those "marinas" that's 18" deep at every low tide.

Edited by - on

bigelowp
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1776 Posts

Response Posted - 10/16/2010 : 15:01:37

Your "summer" home is being very short sited as you will (have) mentioned this to others who may decide not to do business with them. I too am surprised at the 10/23 date. Most use end of month dates (October) and are flexible as they can not haul EVERY boat on one day. All that said, however, marinas are in business and as many (especially on the CT shore) are not too concerned with cost they push as hard as they can. I trailer my 17ft skiff to the place I bought it -- 3 hours away -- and he tried to do a similar thing, charging me for storage after the winter season and I simply asked "do you want me to drive all this distance to be a customer or not?" He got it. So I would call the yard manager and nicely say that you have been a loyal customer and would like to continue so, therefore, would he let you stay until 10/31 with no additional fees or should you be looking elsewhere for a good long-term relationship.

Edited by - on

Prospector
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
3159 Posts

Response Posted - 10/16/2010 : 15:01:47

We hauled out today - along with most of teh rest of our fleet.

the Town docks our Sailing Association rents are lean on resources and tight on rules. We all have to be out before midnight on teh 31st. Its been that way for years. Trouble is they keep upping fees in teh off seasons and NOT putting it in the contract. You would think that since we rent over half the marina from them, do their slip assignments, and maintain the facility, we would have more clout, but they keep threatening to remove the club, and just assign the slips to whoever comes along.

We are staring down a 200% slip fee increase next year.

We are also pricing out marinas on lake Ontario. Especially since there are some nice ones very close to my office. If our fees will be that high, we might as well go to a marina with some facilities on the "Big Lake." If we go, it will be quite an adventure moving the boat there.

Edited by - on

pastmember
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2402 Posts

Response Posted - 10/17/2010 : 13:07:20

Go, the adventure is over at your old lake.

Edited by - on

Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3321 Posts

Response Posted - 10/17/2010 : 14:49:23

Oh! The joy of not having to haul out in the Fall...I'm sorry for you Northerners.

Edited by - on

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5377 Posts

Response Posted - 10/17/2010 : 18:23:14

One of my buddies stays in all winter, and generally with salt water, his mooring does not freeze. He hauls every second year to perform maintenance, etc.

I spoke with several dockmates about the situation. All of them will winter on the hard at the marina. Most of them understood my issue and were glad I came up with a solution.

I scoped out the mooring today, 7 feet of water at low tide, and only a short sprint from the launch area.

I plan to have a heart to heart talk with the yard boss this week, and want to negotiate a good deal for next summer. I like being on a slip for many of the reasons listed above.

Last year I was charged for my LOA at $2800, however next year they will probably charge me for a 30 foot slip. The bill will probably exceed $3400. I will mention that in my current spot, I touched bottom at mean low low water twice, so I want a better slip.

If we can split the difference, I won't be terribly upset. If he comes in higher than that, I intend to make the stipulation that I can stay until Oct 31, 2011. We'll see how things go ....

Edited by - on

Prospector
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
3159 Posts

Response Posted - 10/17/2010 : 19:45:16

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by pastmember
 Go, the adventure is over at your old lake.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I tend to agree Frank, but I'm like th eguy at teh slots - just one more pull... I really wanna beat Newfie Screach on the summer series, and I would have to stick around to do that. Rumour is that he is looking at a new boat though - if he pulls the trigger, I'm outta here and on my way to bigger water.

Edited by - on

Prospector
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
3159 Posts

Response Posted - 10/17/2010 : 19:49:55

Bruce, we are currently paying about $1000 for a bare slip - no hydro or water, pumpout is $25 a pop. Nearest restaurant is a 10 minute walk. Showers and bathrooms are bare concrete floors with a single bare bulb. We are not allowed to store anything on site. No crane, no staff, no vending machines, nothing, and the docks are open to the public all day, with a single visit from a security guard every night at 11:00.

Our club has a shed on th epremises which the town complains needs to be removed as it is against the zoning bylaw.

But, its only $1000 (this season)

Edited by - on

OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 10/18/2010 : 04:22:02

Our mooring at a PA state park, $475.

Winter storage, $80

Edited by - on

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5377 Posts

Response Posted - 10/18/2010 : 12:16:33

Chris
I agree, it's time to move down to the Big Lake. Do you need to trailer it, or can you motor via canal? We have a trailer guy around here who charges something like $400 to move your boat within a 20 km radius. Is there a similar service in your area?

OJ,
I can get a great mooring/floating dock in a nice, protected (Milford) harbor for about $400 for the year. There's a little more than 18" of water even at low tide, but the deal is you have to use the dink. Once you're on a slip, you get a little spoiled.

In this case, my winter storage will be more costly, but we have power & water (in season).

But didn't someone say something about "a hole in the water you throw money into . . . ? ? ?"

Edited by - on

PCP777
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1225 Posts

Response Posted - 10/18/2010 : 13:21:30

Wow, I'm glad I don't have to hassle with all this. I pay $165 a month for a 27 foot slip on a floating dock with water and electricity. If I use a bunch of power they will meter me but I don't. I'm about 100 feet from the bathrooms, showers and the marina store and office. Behind that is a big night club with a country bar and a rock bar restaurant with pool tables etc. and an outdoor bar for smokers. We have card key access gates which pretty much means that criminal elements have to come in from the water. We also have night security. I only pull out to do a bottom job and we can pretty much sail year round. Our docks float, are very stable and of course no tide. But I have to say this, you guys can go anywhere, up and down the sound or whatever. I'm trapped in a lake. But at least it's a nice lake.

Right now we have four C-25's including mine in a row on our dock. Two are forum members I've met/sailed with.

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
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Djibouti
9081 Posts

Response Posted - 10/18/2010 : 15:24:45

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by PCP777
 ...But I have to say this, you guys can go anywhere, up and down the sound or whatever. I'm trapped in a lake...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Yup--when I head for Block Island, I'm thinking "...if I miss the island, the next stop is probably either the Azores, Spain, Portugal or Morocco." (... well, actually wherever I run out of gas.) But there are just about unlimited venues within a day or two from here, from NYC to Martha's Vineyard and Nantucket, with closer places like Watch Hill, the Narragansett, Block Island, Shelter Island, The Hamptons, the Connecticut River, and many other things. Although I grew up sailing and boating on inland lakes, I'd get claustrophobia now.

Edited by - on

JohnP
Master Marine Consultant

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1520 Posts

Response Posted - 10/18/2010 : 18:06:49

Peter,

You do have a great lake. You also have good sailing buddies, including your admiral, fun places to go, good weather (except for the blazing summer), and a nice marina setup. I guess I can't tell if I would ever travel to the Dallas-Ft. Worth area ever again on business, but it was fun sailing with you and seeing your Catalina 25!

Edited by - on

PCP777
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1225 Posts

Response Posted - 10/19/2010 : 08:01:31

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Stinkpotter
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by PCP777
 ...But I have to say this, you guys can go anywhere, up and down the sound or whatever. I'm trapped in a lake...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Yup--when I head for Block Island, I'm thinking "...if I miss the island, the next stop is probably either the Azores, Spain, Portugal or Morocco." (... well, actually wherever I run out of gas.) But there are just about unlimited venues within a day or two from here, from NYC to Martha's Vineyard and Nantucket, with closer places like Watch Hill, the Narragansett, Block Island, Shelter Island, The Hamptons, the Connecticut River, and many other things. Although I grew up sailing and boating on inland lakes, I'd get claustrophobia now.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Ah yes, I remember putting out of Rowayton Ct. on my dad's Cheoy Lee 28 and gunkholing for two weeks up to Block Island and back. I just don't miss that cold weather although I do miss the snow.

[quote]Peter,

You do have a great lake. You also have good sailing buddies, including your admiral, fun places to go, good weather (except for the blazing summer), and a nice marina setup. I guess I can't tell if I would ever travel to the Dallas-Ft. Worth area ever again on business, but it was fun sailing with you and seeing your Catalina 25!
[quote]

It was great sailing with you as well, we sure could've used some more wind. A bit more wind makes that sun much more bearable. If you make it down again we can go out, it's actually been a great summer for wind in comparison to last season.

If anyone is ever in the Dallas Fort Worth area, message me and we can go sailing. We can go 12 months out of the year but if it's toward the winter make sure to pack layers of clothes.

Edited by - on

Prospector
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
3159 Posts

Response Posted - 10/19/2010 : 11:27:53

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Voyager
 Chris
I agree, it's time to move down to the Big Lake. Do you need to trailer it, or can you motor via canal? We have a trailer guy around here who charges something like $400 to move your boat within a 20 km radius. Is there a similar service in your area?

...But didn't someone say something about "a hole in the water you throw money into . . . ? ? ?"
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Yeah we have those sorts of service available - $1200 to get a truck to Cherry Spit in Toronto. If I go, I'll drop the mast and take the canal to Trenton (Ontario), then raise the mast adn sail to the big stink.

The canal is supposed to take between 4-6 days depending on weather and traffic. Sailing the lake is supposed to be another 2. One day to Cobourg, and a second Day to the Toronto area. I have been in touch with a couple YC's and I'm just rolling things around on my tongue to get a taste for them.

This past summer I crewed on a race with a guy from one of the clubs I'm considering, and it was fun, but not my cup o' tea. I think I make awful crew. I have too many ideas, and that skipper was in it to win, he didn't want to hear from me.

I've also been thinking bigger lake = bigger boat. Maybe something fast. Maybe something like this: http://toronto.kijiji.ca/c-cars-vehicles-boats-watercraft-sailboats-Banner-28-Racer-W0QQAdIdZ234974888

Oh wait - I have no money.

Edited by - on

PCP777
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1225 Posts

Response Posted - 10/19/2010 : 12:59:18

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Prospector
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Voyager
 Chris
I agree, it's time to move down to the Big Lake. Do you need to trailer it, or can you motor via canal? We have a trailer guy around here who charges something like $400 to move your boat within a 20 km radius. Is there a similar service in your area?

...But didn't someone say something about "a hole in the water you throw money into . . . ? ? ?"
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
This past summer I crewed on a race with a guy from one of the clubs I'm considering, and it was fun, but not my cup o' tea. I think I make awful crew. I have too many ideas, and that skipper was in it to win, he didn't want to hear from me.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I chuckled at this. When crewing, it's tough to put your "skipper/boat owner" mentality on hold, which really you have to do to be a good crew member when racing. Also, you have to find the right boat with thr right skipper to crew on, but I digress.

Sorry to go off topic. Carry on!

Edited by - on

Voyager
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USA
5377 Posts

Response Posted - 10/22/2010 : 19:49:30

So tomorrow is the day I leave the marina and will spend two weeks on a mooring before I haul out in early November. I checked with the town harbormaster and asked whether anybody has had their boats broken into while on a mooring up on the river.

He said that in this mooring field, they've had no problems. The field is located outside of the channel, but the channel takes a dogleg around this mooring area, so some boaters will drive right through at hull speed. Luckily, my mooring is right behind a huge rock.

He suggested I attach a light to the boat while moored. I have a solar light with two 3.2V Lithium rechargeables and three high output LEDs in it, so it will run all night and it's pretty bright.

I've largely emptied the boat of all but day-sailing essentials. I pulled the FM Radio and all overnight gear. I carry my GPS and handheld VHF aboard in my duffel bag. I've only got a few flashlights and handtools left aboard. I plan on leaving the solar panel aboard to keep the battery charged up.

The outboard is still tethered on using a 5/8" airplane SS cable and a rusted kryptonite lock. I'm hopeful mobody tries to steal it, as they will probably just ruin something instead.

I hope to sail a few more days and eves before the end, but there's no way to know that. I will sail on Saturday morning and afternoon.

Edited by - on

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5377 Posts

Response Posted - 10/25/2010 : 18:07:46

So off I went to the mooring on Sunday and I found there was no pennant (well it was very short) when I got there. I added some polypropylene floating lines so I can grab the mooring with my boathook, then added a pair of 5/8" lines connected to a fender and tied to the ball. I tied up for a while and tried getting on and off the kayak from the ladder. In the chop and the current on the river, it was challenging to say the least. Under those conditions, it would be very easy to flip the kayak or have a mishap.

I will not opt for a mooring next year, and plan to return to a slip at the marina. The "convincer" for me was when I got off the boat, paddled back to the car, got in the car, drove down the road, looked for my phone at the next light, then I realized I'd left it back in the boat!

.

Luckily, as I got back to the launch site, I saw a friend with his dink and asked him for a lift back to the boat, which he kindly obliged me. Like I said elsewhere, I'm spoiled, so I don't think I'll be saving any money next season on a slip (unless I have no choice).

Edited by - on

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