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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

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Swim Ladder Questions.

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limey156
1st Mate

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89 Posts

Initially Posted - 06/10/2011 : 07:04:05

Hello gents,

I am going to replace my crappy removable side mount swim ladder and install a transom mount ladder. I think i am going to go with:

http://www.anchoring.com/3-step-transom-mounted-boat-sailboat-ladder.html?osCsid=4vh4ulkbbsbcufbegjfol7u5g7

And ill be mounting it on the Stbd side:

Sun Dancer
1980 C25 SR/SK #1992
Hammock Island Marina, Chesapeake Bay.

Edited by - on

OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 06/10/2011 : 07:27:17

I would want the Catalina designed ladder - but that's just me. You might trying posting a "Wanted" thread on the Swap Meet.

With some extended open-end wrenches you might be able to install the ladder without an inspection port.

Good luck!

Edited by - on

pastmember
Master Marine Consultant

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2402 Posts

Response Posted - 06/10/2011 : 07:41:41

Gosh, I think you have found a great ladder, will not need the CD access port because you are working in the quarter berth. You will be able to get to the lower bolts from the lower gudgeon access panel and the top bolts can be accessed one of several ways. Here come the photos!

The late model C25s had an access port in the rope locker, you could install one 5" I think. Or you can come on through the quarterberth liner to a backing board at the quarterberth shelf.

Edited by - on

pastmember
Master Marine Consultant

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2402 Posts

Response Posted - 06/10/2011 : 07:45:41

I did not realize an '80 model still had the scuppers in the forward part of the cockpit. If you are going to work on your transom I would give serious thought to installing transom scuppers. CD has a kit or you can find alternatives elsewhere; a comment on CD... their products are well thought out.

Edited by - on

PCP777
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1225 Posts

Response Posted - 06/10/2011 : 08:29:26

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by pastmember
 I did not realize an '80 model still had the scuppers in the forward part of the cockpit. If you are going to work on your transom I would give serious thought to installing transom scuppers. CD has a kit or you can find alternatives elsewhere; a comment on CD... their products are well thought out.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Hmm, my 79 has stern scuppers.

Edited by - on

limey156
1st Mate

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89 Posts

Response Posted - 06/10/2011 : 08:34:44

I have scuppers in the aft part of my cockpit, one in each corner. you can just make out one in this picture, above the brown shoes (not me).

Edited by - limey156 on 06/10/2011 08:35:31

limey156
1st Mate

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89 Posts

Response Posted - 06/10/2011 : 12:21:00

So do i need to reinforce the transom from behind when installing a ladder?

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 06/10/2011 : 12:51:34

I would reinforce it. Use a 1/4-1/2" thick piece of starboard (or marine plywood) and round the corners with a sander. Mark and drill the holes in the starboard/plywood first, and attach the ladder to it in a dry run. Next, remove the backing plate rom the ladder and use it as a template to drill the holes in the transom. I did this for our C-22 when I added a ladder and it has worked very well.

Edited by - on

jerlim
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1484 Posts

Response Posted - 06/11/2011 : 01:49:36

I recommend against the plywood. IMHO, you are installing a significant structural element and advise you to go to a high degree on integrity (structural, not moral...). Spring the extra $$$ and go for the starboard.

Edited by - on

Jay Schkloven
1st Mate

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USA
84 Posts

Response Posted - 06/11/2011 : 07:35:23

When I added the ladder I reinforced the inside with 1/2 exterior plywood. The area is generally dry back there and the 1/2 wood is plenty support. I made the wood just small enough to go through the circle port I did have to cut. I placed my ladder on the port side.

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9087 Posts

Response Posted - 06/11/2011 : 08:40:08

The CD ladder, which appears to replicate the factory model, should mount on the starboard side easily, without inspection ports. It's mounting points are low enough to be accessible in the quarterberth. I'm suspicious, however, that the Norestar ladder's two upper mounting points (out of four) might be above the level of the cockpit seat, which means you'll probably need inspection ports in the transom above the seat. I'd try to figure that out before making a choice.

Edited by - on

pastmember
Master Marine Consultant

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2402 Posts

Response Posted - 06/11/2011 : 09:09:54

I am weirded out by the scupper deal. Does your boat have two holes on the bottom of the hull under the scuppers? You do know your transom is lacking the scupper exits... right?

Edited by - on

pastmember
Master Marine Consultant

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2402 Posts

Response Posted - 06/11/2011 : 09:15:24

Could you post your HIN? Something is not right. Why does it look like you have two manual bilge pumps? Do you own a Jaguar 25 from England?

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9087 Posts

Response Posted - 06/11/2011 : 09:28:39

His signature says HN 1992 (obviously not the model year).

Edited by - on

Boomeroo
Navigator

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Australia
129 Posts

Response Posted - 06/11/2011 : 18:06:40

Regarding the ladder position and internal reinforcement, it is the upper bolts that require the internal support as the load is out . the lower bolts have very low loads. Other designs don't have lower bolts.
my experience with the boarding ladder is the lower it is the better. the lower step is under a lot of load in a forward direction as you swing your weight up onto the ladder .My ladder only goes about 10in into the water and needs at least another 10 inch to be easy to get out of the water

re the drain holes in the stern . these are very easy and cheap to install just a short length of plastic pipe 11/2 0r 2 inch .

After a swim and shower at the stern these drain immediately.
Remember that the stern ladder is a very important safety devise especially if you fall o'board while underway .

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 06/11/2011 : 18:50:48

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by pastmember
 I am weirded out by the scupper deal. Does your boat have two holes on the bottom of the hull under the scuppers? <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

My 80 has drains in the cockpit floor at the transom that drain through holes on the bottom of th hull.

Edited by - on

pastmember
Master Marine Consultant

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2402 Posts

Response Posted - 06/11/2011 : 20:06:04

I misunderstood when they stopped using the hull location and went to the through transom design. You know your a Catalina 25 geek when you are actually glad to learn things like this!!

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 06/12/2011 : 04:46:39

The early C-25's built in the 70's, like the C-22's, had a cockpit drain in each forward corner of the cockpit floor. The drain tubes met at a Y-connector and drained into the keel trunk behind the volcano on swing keel boats. That system has a significant limitation in that the 2 drains are restricted to 1 exit point in the hull. We added the transom scuppers to our C-22 a few years ago and I just rebedded them with 4200 this year. I was thinking the transom scuppers became a standard item on the C-25 with the 1982 model, but I could be wrong.

Edited by - on

Joe Diver
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1218 Posts

Response Posted - 06/12/2011 : 08:22:37

Mine is an '82...it has the transom scuppers and isolated fuel locker. I think '82 was the first year of those changes.

Edited by - on

NCBrew
Captain

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USA
338 Posts

Response Posted - 06/12/2011 : 08:35:36

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by limey156
 Hello gents,

I am going to replace my crappy removable side mount swim ladder and install a transom mount ladder. I think i am going to go with:

http://www.anchoring.com/3-step-transom-mounted-boat-sailboat-ladder.html?osCsid=4vh4ulkbbsbcufbegjfol7u5g7

And ill be mounting it on the Stbd side:

(this pic is from when i purchased the boat last year. it is in the water now.)

Do i need to buy this to install the ladder?

http://www.catalinadirect.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=product.display& product_ID=1320

Do i need to install some backing material like plywood to reinforce behind the transom?

I looked at the Catalina Direct model

http://www.catalinadirect.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=product.display& product_ID=623& ParentCat=272

but i am not sure it is worth the premium, and the other model has the mounting points spread out which looks like less strain on the hull.

I'd appreciate any inputs you fella's may have.

Thanks!
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

In the link for the 3-Step Transom Mounted Boat/Sailboat Ladder, Do you know the distance between the top mounting and the bottom mounting bar. (how far apart are the mounting holes, both horizontal and vertical).
For $99.99 I think I will order this one. The ladder on my Catalina 25 has very skinny rungs and it is tough on old feet.
Thanks

Edited by - NCBrew on 06/12/2011 08:39:50

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9087 Posts

Response Posted - 06/12/2011 : 09:04:55

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by NCBrew
 ...The ladder on my Catalina 25 has very skinny rungs and it is tough on old feet.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Before you buy another ladder, go to Catalinadirect.com and search on "step pad".

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 06/12/2011 : 12:04:44

I added the step pads to the ladder on our '84 boat. Makes all the difference in the world. Getting on the first step is still hard as it is not very deep in the water. I'm going to add an extra step using rope and 2 boards. Still working on the design. My idea is to loop the line around the bottom step on each side and tie it off to the next step up, distributing the initial load to 2 steps instead of the bottom only.

Edit: I've cut 2 pieces from a 2x4, each 7" wide, that I'm going to space about 8" apart, making 2 extra steps. I've drilled 7/16" holes at each end for 3/8" line

Edited by - dmpilc on 06/12/2011 12:52:13

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9087 Posts

Response Posted - 06/12/2011 : 13:08:20

Given that 2x4s tend to float, how will it be deeper?

Edited by - on

NCBrew
Captain

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USA
338 Posts

Response Posted - 06/12/2011 : 13:42:31

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Stinkpotter
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by NCBrew
 ...The ladder on my Catalina 25 has very skinny rungs and it is tough on old feet.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Before you buy another ladder, go to Catalinadirect.com and search on "step pad".
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
I made ladder rungs from Oak wood but drilling through the stainless is a bear.

Edited by - on

dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 06/12/2011 : 18:04:40

I may still need to add weights to the 2x4's. The idea is that we can push down with our hand, guide a foot onto the first 2x4 without having to bring the foot almost to the surface. Also, the leg won't be bent at such an awkward angle on the first pull up onto the ladder.

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Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9087 Posts

Response Posted - 06/12/2011 : 20:28:56

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by dmpilc
 ...The idea is that we can push down with our hand, guide a foot onto the first 2x4 without having to bring the foot almost to the surface. Also, the leg won't be bent at such an awkward angle on the first pull up onto the ladder.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">My experience with a rope-based ladder is that when you put your weight on the bottom rung, it swings under the boat, virtually against the bottom, and you end up pulling horizontally very hard to get yourself up to the next step. This might be tolerable for a casual swimmer, but in an emergency situation with an exhausted person, it could be a deal-breaker. A rigid ladder with stand-offs is much better.

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