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BreakAwayFL
Deckhand

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USA
4 Posts

Initially Posted - 01/27/2012 : 09:41:07

Hello everyone! I'm new here, and new to Catalinas. I'm about to ppurchase a Catalina 25 ('82). I live in Fort Lauderdale and will be sailing mainly in the Keys at first, and then the Keys and the Bahamas.

I'm looking for any insight or things to look out for as I examine this boat. I don't mind a little work, but I would have to factor the cost of repairs into the final offer price.

THank you and I'm excited to become a part of the Catalina family!

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9081 Posts

Response Posted - 01/27/2012 : 09:51:01

Welcome, Nelson!

What keel--swing, fin, or (unlikely in an '82) wing? That will be a big factor in our responses.

I'm one of the stronger proponents here of a professional survey before the purchase. There are things like moisture in the plywood deck core, condition of rigging, adequacy of electrical systems, etc., that some people aren't qualified or equipped to determine. You can participate in the inspection, ask lots of questions (I took a clipboard), and will get a detailed report with work items and their urgency. This gives credibility for the final negotiation, which might pay for the survey (think $400), or will cause you to walk away, which can be even more valuable!

Also, some (not all) insurers require a survey for a boat over 10 years old (or some other number)--if yours does, you might as well let the survey work for you in your negotiations.

Best of luck!

Edited by - on

aeckhart
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1709 Posts

Response Posted - 01/27/2012 : 09:53:03

Nelson,

This is a frequent question on this site and there is lots of information in the archives. Go the the "search" function at the top of the page and type in "buying/selling". Look for a response from Prospector, one of our members. There should be some good info regarding what to look for and price expectations. More can be found by searching the archives.

Edited by - aeckhart on 01/27/2012 09:54:15

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9081 Posts

Response Posted - 01/27/2012 : 09:59:51

Also, look in the Tech Tips section (menu at left), and on its main page, there are two articles by one of our members on shopping for and appraising a C-25.

Glancing at the "appraising" one, I'll mention that regarding the rudder, you're looking at an "early" year. If the rudder does not have a "step" that extends under the skeg at the transom, it's probably the original "unbalanced" rudder. Those are the ones with a wood core in the head, which tends to swell and split the shell. A new replacement is a little more than Larry suggests--more like $650+, but they're significant improvements on the original design.

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 01/27/2012 10:06:42

waterbaby
Navigator

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USA
168 Posts

Response Posted - 01/27/2012 : 10:55:46

Welcome Nelson,
I'm a relative newby also, since I bought my boat last April. You have definately come to the right place for support. The folks on this site are awsome.

I would agree with Dave B on the survey. You won't regret getting one done, but you might very well regret not getting one. We were pretty naive when we bought ours and got lucky but since we're a little more informed now, we will definately get a survey if we ever buy another.

Keep us up to date on this new adventure your having. BTW - I'll be in your neck of the woods in April. We're coming to spend a week in Key Largo. So if you have any tips for us on where to go/what to do let me know.

Edited by - on

Joe Diver
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1218 Posts

Response Posted - 01/27/2012 : 11:10:40

How did you find your boat? Do you have a link to an ad or something we can look at?

Edited by - on

John Russell
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3444 Posts

Response Posted - 01/27/2012 : 13:32:12

Welcome to the forum and Association. You'll find a lot of great information here. Good luck with the hunt!
Try these:

Great Reference. Probably available at your local Barnes & Nobles.

This one is probably a better choice since it includes the above and 4 other of his books in one volume.

Edited by - John Russell on 01/27/2012 13:34:58

JimGo
Admiral

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USA
962 Posts

Response Posted - 01/27/2012 : 20:07:29

Welcome aboard! As everyone has said, it's a great site. The folks here helped talk me OUT of buying the first C25 I inspected. After that experience, and knowing what a great "support" network was available, I felt a lot more comfortable when I was ready to make the offer on our boat a few months ago.

Good luck, and again, welcome!

Edited by - on

Arlington
Navigator

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USA
196 Posts

Response Posted - 01/28/2012 : 19:39:51

Hi Nelson:
Welcome Aboard! The Catalina 25 is a great boat! I'll second the recommendation to get a survey, before you make an offer on a boat. No matter how wonderful the deal seems to be, it is best to get a survey. It's also a good idea to check around and find a local yacht club with Catalina 22's and 25's. You can usually come as a guest, and chances are good you will find sailors that are familiar with the different Catalina models. Often you can get a chance to help sail or crew on a boat similar to the boat you are considering.

I saw this quote elsewhere here on the Forum, "Son, there will always be good deals on boats".

Edited by - on

Ken Ward
Deckhand

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USA
7 Posts

Response Posted - 01/30/2012 : 18:07:15

Welcome from one new forum member to another. I just made the 'no survey' choice and bought an 86 fixed keel from a work acquaintance who came highly recommended. This was a quick sale, significantly reduced price (half) with a 2 yr. old motor. With all the warnings about getting surveys, there are nearly as many about getting the right surveyor. Not to knock the profession, but when the survey and hauling costs are 1/3 or more the cost of the boat, I took a chance. Keeping in mind what my sailing instructor told me, I went after the boat because it looked good and the price was right. He said that if the boat isn't attractive, you'll spend more than the cost of a newer one just fixing up the old wreck! (I bought a 22 swing keel that was very worn but cheap, a '74 with a foredeck that felt like a trampoline and put in more money than I paid for her trying to fix it up. And yes, no survey and lots of disappointing surprises.) I traded up to the 25', 1986 and in some ways history repeated itself! Buying '86 or newer did give me the latest design though I'm told, as the basic boat has not changed since that time. Earlier models differ somewhat. The guy I bought from warned me the porthole (window) in the head had a leak that needed attention. I live near Sarasota, and when it rained, sure enough there was about a two gallon of water in the bilge. Two tries with caulking and the leak was fixed. I then found that she leaked wherever there was a screw/bolt fitting through the topside! Replacing every bolt and nut, reglassing through the holes and recaulking was about $250 in parts, but days and days of drilling out screw heads, cutting bolts off and busting knuckles! Luckily, there was no damage to the topside plywood surrounding the boltholes, and I got to know the boat while working on it. Oh yeah, the electric wiring was pretty much gone to seed too, but I was lucky to find a mast ladder that helped while replacing the lighting. The switch-fuse panel was miswired and took me about 4 days to rewire the fore and aft light, trace out every wire and reorganize the panel so the fan didn't come on when you switched on the mast light! I consider myself lucky that so far I only found one rotted bulkhead from the months of leaking topside holes, which just happened to be the one that holds the fuse panel. Once a professional carpenter of sorts, I have taken a lot of the problems in stride. I dive and clean my own bottom about once a month as she sits in the water all the time, and I was able to inspect the bottom myself, and I did sea trial before I handed out the final cash. I have spent more time working on the boat than sailing, about 10 to 1, and have owned it 9 months or so, but then I insisted on fixing all the night running lights in case I need to stay out for whatever reason. So, as to survey or not? It is probably worth the peace of mind, at least decreasing significantly the amount of time you will be wondering, what next! There are plenty of maintenance needs without surprises, and some of those surprises could endanger you and/or someone you love! If you have faith in your own abilities and are able to shake off the disappointments you may find, go ahead with the gamble. You'll probably spend as much fixing up what you missed seeing as the survey will cost, and lots of insurance companies require a survey when you apply for full coverage. Have I muddied the water enough? Still 'lucky' in Sarasota.

Edited by - on

JimGo
Admiral

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USA
962 Posts

Response Posted - 01/30/2012 : 22:53:11

Ken,
I went without a survey, too. I wouldn't generally recommend that course of action, but like you, my survey would have approached a significant percentage of the purchase price. I wonder, though, whether the price might have been justified if the survey was "simply" while the boat was in the water, with the surveyor providing feedback as to what's wrong, what NEEDS to be done (and in what order), what SHOULD be one (and in what order), etc.

Edited by - on

OLarryR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3466 Posts

Response Posted - 01/31/2012 : 04:49:59

Well...there is the survey issue and agree that would be the conservative/smart way to go to ensure you do not get bit by some major work issue that may be beyond what you would want to do yourself and could cost big bucks. Though, I did not get a survey.

There are obviously many things to check out on a boat prior to buying and I do not have a lot of time this morning to prepare a full checklist but they are elsewhere on this forum buried in archioved postings and possibly in the technical tips, etc parts of this Association website.

Is the boat in the water ? If so, then you cannot easily inspect the bottom to see the condition of the hull and if there is the so called "smile" indicating a separation between the keel and the hull.

Does the cabin have a musty smell, other than from being closed up for some time. If odor quickly dissipates once onboard, then probably no big deal.

I would check the bilge and see how clean it is and if the studs that hold the keel are shiny or show indications of rust.

Is everything basically in working order and the boat has the appearance that someone has been regularly maintaining it ?

Does the outboard start easily and run smoothly ?

If even from these few questions if you get a favorable impression, then it is a boat at least worthy of further consideration.

Now having said that....Not everyone is necessarily looking for a boat in what appears to be pristine condition (and ....there is always the chance that there are some hidden issues that perhaps would be uncovered in a survey). Some boats that may not be in a well maintained condition may be harder to sell and may be offered at a significantly lower price and that can attract some individuals that really want to get a boat at a bargain price and are quite capable of tending to extended tasks to bring the boat back to decent sailing and appearance condition.

Edited by - on

Sam001
Vice Commodore

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USA
441 Posts

Response Posted - 02/01/2012 : 09:27:42

I agree that it is a price-value issue, and if one can do repairs and the estimate of the cost of those repairs still is below what the "average value" of the boat is---then the value is there.

Edited by - on

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