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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

General Sailing Forum

Hydraulic coupler: is reverse lock out necessary?

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delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Initially Posted - 05/17/2012 : 12:34:14

Our Attwood (?) coupler is toast, last time we launched, we had to literally pound it off of the hitch with a mallet. I've got a line on a replacement Titan coupler that has everything my current one does except the reverse lock out for backing. The guy wants about 1/3 the cost of a new one which is attractive given my employment status.

We strap launch, so backing while connected to the trailer would be minimal. The most likely place problems would crop up is pushing the empty trailer up the slight hill of our driveway. We also have drum brakes if that makes any difference.

Do all of you guys have a reverse lock out on your coupler if you're using surge brakes?

David
C-250 Mainsheet Editor

Sirius Lepak
1997 C-250 WK TR #271 --Seattle area Port Captain --

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Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5902 Posts

Response Posted - 05/17/2012 : 12:55:29

My EZ Loader trailer had a reverse lock, and the trailer wheels locked whenever I had to back into my driveway. I hated it. If there's a reason for it, I never knew what it was. Maybe it could be justified as a sort of parking brake for the trailer and it's load, but I don't remember it ever locking on the boat ramp, and I would never trust it anyway. I always had a friend block the wheels with big rocks when I stopped on the ramp.

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OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 05/17/2012 : 13:05:09

Our 2010 Trail-Rite has a lock-out - which is (as you know) controlled by tow vehicle's back-up lights. Until we added the 5th wire and tried backing up - it was like someone threw chocks under our wheels. Ugh! There is a mechanical bypass (a pin) to the lock-out. FWIW we have quad discs.

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delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 05/17/2012 : 13:29:32

My understanding is that the lock out would prevent the brakes from engaging while backing. I have never bothered trying to use the one on my current coupler, the PO said it wasn't necessary and I don't recall problems backing up the drive with it.

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OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 05/17/2012 : 13:40:25

David, perhaps the shoes are pushing against the drums but you can still back up - similar to the emergency brake on a car? Our 1981 trailer worked like that.

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DavidCrosby
Navigator

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USA
240 Posts

Response Posted - 05/17/2012 : 14:38:29

Mine has a lever on the right side of the coupler. It has a reverse position and a tow position. The lever normally lives in the tow position. When you want to back up, you have to get out and flop that lever to the reverse position.

The purpose of this on surge brakes is because the brakes are applied when the trailer coupler shoves against the ball, in turn applying hydraulic pressure to the brakes. Backing up has the exact same effect as hitting the brakes on your car. So, flip that little lever and bypass the hydraulic action.

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dmpilc
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4593 Posts

Response Posted - 05/17/2012 : 15:28:54

Before you change out the coupler/actuator (easily $250 or more, been there, done that ), try shooting a bunch of WD-40 up inside the coupler, and around the reverse lock-out switch and try to work the moving parts loose. Most likely, the moving parts have rusted up a bit. The one bad thing about strap launching is that the coupler/actuator gets completely submerged. Easy for moving parts to develop rust. also, be sure to check the trailer's brake fluid for water intrusion. Sometimes water can get into the reservoir via the vent hole.
P.S. The actuator I bought in July, 2010 at our local shop, Attwood #83010, rated to 8k lbs, for $238 is now $288 at etrailer.com.

Edited by - dmpilc on 05/17/2012 15:42:43

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 05/17/2012 : 16:59:00

Yeah, tried the WD-40 route, the piston assembly seems pretty well toast, but the real problem is the coupler itself. Literally we had to pound it off using a mallet & giant screw driver, the latch wasn't releasing, and nothing we did made it any better, lots of WD-40 while above the ramp after trying to launch and not being able to get the hitch out of the coupler (and lots of swearing). I don't ever want to go through that again on the ramp. There's nothing quite like trying to pop your loaded trailer off it's hitch while you're laying on the ground so you can get a swing at it. We have lots of chocks for the truck and trailer, as well as safety chains, but still pretty scary. And then not knowing if you were going to get the coupler back on the ball again so you can tow it home. We did, by bouncing two guys on the trailer tongue until it popped on again. Then had to do a couple of "panic" stops to get it to seat all the way down so I could close the coupler latch & pin it.

Never again.

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Dave5041
Former Mainsheet Editor

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USA
3758 Posts

Response Posted - 05/17/2012 : 17:03:33

Drum brakes are "self actuating". When brakes are applied in forward motion, the brake shoe shoes shift and increase lining to drum pressure for better stopping power. That doesn't happen effectively in reverse braking so you can overpower the brakes. You will wear the lining faster, but infrequent, short distance use wouldn't be a big problem. That said, I would still try to repair or find an actuator with lock-out if possible. If you don't feel that increase in drag, you need to adjust your brakes. The wheels should lockup or be close to lockup when you try to backup on a slight gravel grade.

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Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3704 Posts

Response Posted - 05/17/2012 : 19:19:34

Yes, you need the reverse lockout solenoid. It's no big deal to install and works very well. We have found that even a slight incline sets the brakes and when our discs go on the wheels stop!

If you are going to strap launch in salt water you should have SS discs IMHO.

Edited by - Nautiduck on 05/17/2012 19:21:25

hewebb
Admiral

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USA
761 Posts

Response Posted - 05/18/2012 : 04:31:28

I have a tandem utility trailer with surge brakes and there is a hole through the system at the hitch you put a pin through to stop the cylinder from functioning. I found this out by accident, but it works. You might want to check to see of the inexpensive one has that type of arrangement.

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OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 05/18/2012 : 09:29:00

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by hewebb
 I have a tandem utility trailer with surge brakes and there is a hole through the system at the hitch you put a pin through to stop the cylinder from functioning. I found this out by accident, but it works. You might want to check to see of the inexpensive one has that type of arrangement.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">Just don't be absentminded when using this pin!

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islander
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4024 Posts

Response Posted - 05/18/2012 : 12:56:54

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"> there is a hole through the system at the hitch you put a pin through to stop the cylinder from functioning<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I had a trailer without a reverse lock up, I drilled a hole in the side of the coupler and would insert a bolt when I needed to back up preventing the coupler from compressing. Worked like the above quote.

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delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 05/18/2012 : 13:04:07

Well, this all may have been for naught, I haven't heard back from the guy after a couple of email exchanges, so maybe it's already sold.

Thanks for the help & suggestions guys.

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pastmember
Master Marine Consultant

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2402 Posts

Response Posted - 05/18/2012 : 16:12:35

I converted to electric; made the issue moot.

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Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3704 Posts

Response Posted - 05/18/2012 : 16:45:55

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by pastmember
 I converted to electric; made the issue moot.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Frank, do you put the trailer in the water or lift the boat in?

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