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Hurricane Isaac heading for Tampa - Storm prep...

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redviking
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1771 Posts

Initially Posted - 08/23/2012 : 16:04:37

Decision time! Do I stay tied up to the floating docks behind a decent breakwater, go and anchor out with six hooks down, or go and pick up a dock and dinghy a couple hooks way out as a backup? Will strip the sails, bimini, solar panels, lash down the wind gen, but will probably leave dodgers up as I have Macrolon AR windows and they are thick and don't fold up...

Damn Republicans have brought the wrath of god to my hurricane hole.

Sten

Edited by - on

Tom Potter
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1913 Posts

Response Posted - 08/23/2012 : 16:31:51

The dreaded "I" hurricane causing havoc again, it was about this time last year when Irene had me making those same sort of choices. If it were me, I would anchor out and get away from the docks. I set 2 anchors 180 degrees apart with no issues, the eye went over my house. So how high is that bulkhead? We had about a 8 foot surge with Irene.
Sten are you going to stay aboard?

Edited by - Tom Potter on 08/23/2012 16:37:46

glivs
Admiral

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USA
836 Posts

Response Posted - 08/23/2012 : 16:44:22

BTW...the 1900 storm that took Galveston out (the first time) is sometimes called "Isaac's Storm", after the meteorologist who tried to prep authorities for such an event.

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5897 Posts

Response Posted - 08/23/2012 : 16:58:10

Unless you know of a really good, well-sheltered hurricane hole with enough space for another boat, I'd stay there. You might consider having your boat hauled and set on jackstands. Some insurance companies will split the costs of the haulout with the owner (I think Boat US is one of them), because they believe the risk of damage is greatly reduced. You could call Boat US and ask.

Make your preparations, and then leave the boat. Either your preparations will be sufficient or not. If they aren't, there's really almost nothing you can do during a hurricane to save the boat.

Good luck, and look after yourselves first and foremost! I always check into a motel the night that one passes through.

Edited by - Steve Milby on 08/23/2012 17:04:34

Tradewind
Admiral

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USA
531 Posts

Response Posted - 08/23/2012 : 17:03:41

Sails coming off this weekend with extra lines put on. I don't care for "I" hurricanes, IVAN took my last boat. I'm hoping for it to pass east of Pensacola.

Tomorrow should be a beautiful day for sailing, I plan to be out there for one last good sail before the storm.

Edited by - on

britinusa
Web Editor

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USA
5404 Posts

Response Posted - 08/23/2012 : 17:34:13

We're looking at the outside of the cone at worst.

Feeling for you guys!

Paul

Edited by - on

TakeFive
Master Marine Consultant

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2272 Posts

Response Posted - 08/24/2012 : 06:13:46

Everyone's situation is different. We're probably a lot further inland than you are. Up in PA we're not in the path of this one, but we were in the path of Irene last year. From that experience, I have three general recommendations, especially if you stay in your marina:

- Remove your dodger. Its shape makes a very good wind scoop. The two (power)boats in our marina that left their biminis/dodgers up had them shredded in Irene last year.
- Install an automatic bilge pump if you don't have one already. It may save your boat.
- Buy snubbers for most of your lines. Any redundant lines without snubbers should be looser so the snubbers can slow down the boat's movement before the lines have tension. Otherwise you may pull cleats out of the boat.

For Irene last year, I opted to stay in the marina. BoatUS would have paid half for a haulout, but my boat club wasn't willing to do haulouts so that decision was made for me. I bought 6 snubbers at $42 each to keep the cleats from getting pulled off the boat. These cost me far more than a haulout would have cost! I am fortunate that our marina was less than 50% occupied, so I could move the boat out to use the full double slip. I stripped off all canvas, and even the bimini framework, and even took the boom down below. Then I taped all seams with masking tape. Even with the masking tape, enough water blew into the cracks that the bilge was wet (normally it's bone dry in all conditions), so I'm glad I had installed an automatic bilge pump.

<center>

</center>

Here's another interesting picture from last year. You can clearly see the 5' storm surge in the green residual plot at the top (which fortunately came through at low tide), and the barometric depression in the middle plot:

Edited by - TakeFive on 08/24/2012 06:24:51

JohnP
Master Marine Consultant

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1520 Posts

Response Posted - 08/24/2012 : 06:33:53

Last year I had my boat pulled and kept on stands in the marina parking lot just before hurricane Irene swept up the coast towards Long Island and New England.

The Chesapeake Bay was spared most of the fury of the hurricane, but the surprise to me was the 3-foot lower low tides caused by the rotating hurricane winds pushing water southward out of the Bay into the ocean. With our fixed docks, some boats were hung on their dock lines. Other boats in the marina were heeled over sitting on their keels in the mud! I was glad I had the boat pulled out.

This morning (Friday) the storm models estimate landfall in AL or MS, so that means lots of rain and big high tides in FL, and the opposite to the west in TX.

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5897 Posts

Response Posted - 08/24/2012 : 06:49:23

I agree with Rick - I'd remove the dodger. The windage will add stress to everything - your dock lines, cleats, dock cleats, etc., and the fabric is apt to tear from the stress. I'd get it down. I have never hauled my boat out for a storm or hurricane, but my marina is extraordinarily well-sheltered, sitting down in a little vale, surrounded almost completely by hills, and my slip has always been one of the best sheltered, so I strip the canvas, double the lines, stay with the boat adjusting the lines until the height of the storm, then I trust that my preparations are adequate and leave for a motel.

Edited by - on

Voyager
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
5364 Posts

Response Posted - 08/25/2012 : 07:34:33

Not to put the Kaibosh on storm preps but Isaac is currently a large tropical storm and NOAA estimates it becoming a Cat 1 as it crosses from Cuba to the west coast of FL. If it sticks close to land as it moves northward it should remain a low intensity storm. If it passes further west, the storm should intensify. Because the storm is so vast, even at a lower intensity, storm damage will be severe as the storm will take a long time to pass.

Edited by - on

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9078 Posts

Response Posted - 08/25/2012 : 08:06:00

NOAA currently predicts landfall on the western FL panhandle, with the center passing the Republicans around 100 miles out. I'd be suspicious the counter-clockwise rotation might drag the storm in toward the W coast of FL, like a stuck wheel on a trailer. They do expect him to spin off to the east as he goes inland...

My dock is in an excellent hurricane hole above the I-95 bridge in Mystic. For Irene, I doubled up the dock lines and hoped... Our main concern is a surge that could lift the floating docks off the pilings--we didn't miss by that much with Irene last year, and she had dropped below "tropical storm" before she hit CT.

When we're in the sights of a big one again, I'll be thinking about moving Sarge out into the river and setting my two anchors--hopefully they'll bury in the mud before they let her drag ashore. One concern is that if she drags over to the western shore, we might not be able to get a boat there to pull her out--it's wide and very shallow. She could even end up on the wrong side of a road over there.

The net of it is, Mother Nature rules.

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 08/25/2012 08:16:33

pfduffy
Captain

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USA
317 Posts

Response Posted - 08/25/2012 : 13:44:12

I'm vacationing on Ft. Myers Beach with my family. We have a flight scheduled for tomorrow afternoon out of Ft. Myers. Fingers crossed we get out of here tomorrow!!!

Edited by - on

Tradewind
Admiral

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USA
531 Posts

Response Posted - 08/25/2012 : 17:34:36

Sails off, bimini removed, decks cleared and lines doubled up. Ready as I'll ever be. Maybe someday I'll buy a tow vehicle so I can get it out of the water for the storms.

Cat 2 forecast now.

Edited by - Tradewind on 08/25/2012 17:35:10

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9078 Posts

Response Posted - 08/25/2012 : 20:48:31

The latest forecast suggests the worst of it in Pensacola will be easterly winds. For you folks there, how's your easterly fetch? (I'm guessing there will be lots of takeoffs from Eglin in the next 36 hours.)

We'll be watching and thinking about you...

Edit: Now aiming at Mississippi... Worst winds in Pensacola can be expected to be southerly. The GOP can probably re-schedule Monday.

Edited by - Stinkpotter on 08/26/2012 08:41:22

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4303 Posts

Response Posted - 08/26/2012 : 09:51:51

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Tradewind
 Sails off, bimini removed, decks cleared and lines doubled up. Ready as I'll ever be. Maybe someday I'll buy a tow vehicle so I can get it out of the water for the storms.

Cat 2 forecast now.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
If you have a trailer pull the boat and have a friend tow you to safety OR hire a wrecker to pull the boat and trailer to safety. Far cheaper and less time consuming than losing the boat or having to deal with the insurance company

Edited by - on

redviking
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1771 Posts

Response Posted - 08/26/2012 : 23:05:01

Well, I think we dodged a bullet. Still ablowing 45 knots at the moment. I did not remove the dodger as the macrolon windows do not bend and I risked more damage by removing the dodger than by leaving it up. The dodger is very stout, almost as tough as a hard dodger. Solar panels and bimini were removed. I used extra big ass shackles attached to the toe rail with bicycle innertubes protecting the bowline from chafing. Charged batteries, filled water tanks, used spin halyard to wrap jib, used line to wrap main. Cross cleated all over the place and and sitting it out in the Marina. Breakwater will supposedly withstand a cat 2, so life is good..

Lesser prepared boats are getting trashed!

Sten

EDIT: I noted when I was walking the docks at 03:00 last night that a lot of boats A. had cheesy lines, and B. that they were not tight. ALWAYS soak your lines with water before tieing up. After they get wet, they will stretch.

Edited by - redviking on 08/27/2012 05:26:11

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9078 Posts

Response Posted - 08/27/2012 : 06:28:17

Sten--relax and enjoy the GOMP teaparty!

Edited by - on

PCP777
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1225 Posts

Response Posted - 08/27/2012 : 13:29:45

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by redviking
 Well, I think we dodged a bullet. Still ablowing 45 knots at the moment. I did not remove the dodger as the macrolon windows do not bend and I risked more damage by removing the dodger than by leaving it up. The dodger is very stout, almost as tough as a hard dodger. Solar panels and bimini were removed. I used extra big ass shackles attached to the toe rail with bicycle innertubes protecting the bowline from chafing. Charged batteries, filled water tanks, used spin halyard to wrap jib, used line to wrap main. Cross cleated all over the place and and sitting it out in the Marina. Breakwater will supposedly withstand a cat 2, so life is good..

Lesser prepared boats are getting trashed!

Sten

EDIT: I noted when I was walking the docks at 03:00 last night that a lot of boats A. had cheesy lines, and B. that they were not tight. ALWAYS soak your lines with water before tieing up. After they get wet, they will stretch.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Glad you guys are safe.

Two weekends ago we had a storm bring 75 knot winds into the marina, I was on board Stephanos and it was a bit too exciting for my taste. I have my new docklines being delivered today at the house.

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5897 Posts

Response Posted - 08/27/2012 : 14:59:40

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by redviking
 I noted when I was walking the docks at 03:00 last night that a lot of boats A. had cheesy lines...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">That really surprised me when I first came to the Chesapeake Bay. I expected storm preparations to be seamanlike around the bay, and saw 30', 10,000 lb boats tied up with 1/4" docklines, or with sun rotted 3/8" docklines, and no extra lines for a hurricane. <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">and B. that they were not tight. ALWAYS soak your lines with water before tieing up. After they get wet, they will stretch.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"> If the docks are floating, the docklines should be taut, but if not, your docklines must have enough slack to allow for a huge storm surge.

We have an old-timer named Bruce, a wiry marina worker who comes down to the docks to help adjust docklines during hurricanes. Bruce would stay all night, if we let him. But, when Bruce gets himself in trouble out on the docks, and we have to go out and rescue him, that's when we decide it's time for all of us to go someplace safe and dry for the night. Bruce is like our coal mine canary. If it's too rough for Bruce, we don't have any business being there either.

Edited by - Steve Milby on 08/27/2012 15:03:36

Stinkpotter
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
9078 Posts

Response Posted - 08/27/2012 : 21:23:11

Right! It's just "stuff", and it's insured. In conditions where 30' sailboats end up lying on top of docks (or each other), nobody is going to fix things--they're just going to get hurt or killed.

Edited by - on

PCP777
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1225 Posts

Response Posted - 08/28/2012 : 08:46:19

Question, what is the minimum size in diameter dock lines you would use for a C-25 on a floating dock on a lake? I bought 4 of these in the 3/8 size. It looks like they'd be fine but on the package it says a maximum of 20 feet which surprised me as BoatUS states this:

Line Diameter Boat Length
3/8" up to 25'
1/2" up to 35'
5/8" up to 45'
3/4" up to 55'
7/8" up to 65'

http://www.amazon.com/Attwood-Premium-Double-Braided-Nylon/dp/B002NPV8OC/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1346168900&sr=8-1-fkmr0&keywords=Attwood+Premium+Double+Braided+Nylon+Dock+Lin

Edited by - PCP777 on 08/28/2012 08:50:35

redeye
Master Marine Consultant

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3476 Posts

Response Posted - 08/28/2012 : 09:07:43

I think 3/8 is best, as you usually need a few on each cleat.

I've got 1/2 on one cleat, but only that line will fit on it.

I run 2 3/8 inch lines through the middle hole in the forward dock cleat and put on a snubber and run the line under the pulpit and then a loop over the cleat. Two on each side. pull the line through the dock cleat to adjust and cleat on the dock. Then my spring line is a loop over the forward cleat. My spring lines are relatively tight and my bow and aft lines are relatively loose. balanced so no one line jerks tight alone. Push the boat around and see what moves before you cleat on the dock. You want the spring lines to work with the bow and aft lines.

I put a loop on the spring line by tying a bowline and by adjusting the bowline it changes the length of the spring line.

anyhoo.. I'm sure this is self evident, but sometimes it gets harry just before it hits. Mine held up last time when we got hit and others around me were damaged.

I'm also a proponent of adding cleats, in a heartbeat. 2 1/2 to 3 inch bolts and some plastic cleats. Drill and drop them in and tighten up the nuts with vicegrips on them.

Edited by - on

PCP777
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1225 Posts

Response Posted - 08/28/2012 : 09:14:58

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by redeye
 I think 3/8 is best, as you usually need a few on each cleat.

I've got 1/2 on one cleat, but only that line will fit on it.

I run 2 3/8 inch lines through the middle hole in the forward dock cleat and put on a snubber and run the line under the pulpit and then a loop over the cleat. Two on each side. pull the line through the dock cleat to adjust and cleat on the dock. Then my spring line is a loop over the forward cleat. My spring lines are relatively tight and my bow and aft lines are relatively loose. balanced so no one line jerks tight alone. Push the boat around and see what moves before you cleat on the dock. You want the spring lines to work with the bow and aft lines.

I put a loop on the spring line by tying a bowline and by adjusting the bowline it changes the length of the spring line.

anyhoo.. I'm sure this is self evident, but sometimes it gets harry just before it hits. Mine held up last time when we got hit and others around me were damaged.

I'm also a proponent of adding cleats, in a heartbeat. 2 1/2 to 3 inch bolts and some plastic cleats. Drill and drop them in and tighten up the nuts with vicegrips on them.

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I'm very protected and my half inch line I have is frayed so I thought the 3/8 would work better so I can can run it under the cleat and out and around. OK good, I think I will keep these then.

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5897 Posts

Response Posted - 08/28/2012 : 09:17:10

I used 3/8" for 23 years on an inland lake and never had one break, even when they were at their weakest, just before I replaced them. My main reason for doubling the lines for a hurricane or similar storm is not because my normal dock lines aren't strong enough. It's because lines can chafe during a major storm, and, if one chafes through, I'll have another one already in place to take up the load.

Edited by - on

redeye
Master Marine Consultant

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3476 Posts

Response Posted - 08/28/2012 : 09:53:21

I loop my spring line completely around the dock cleat and then the two other lines that are cleated above it hold it on.

with a bowline on each end I occasionally move the bowline knots and that changes the point the rope turns around the cleat and keeps one spot from getting weak. The bowline knots are easy to move up and down.

anyhoo.. best of weather to you.. Looks like it will be a "not too bad" one.

Edited by - on

PCP777
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1225 Posts

Response Posted - 08/28/2012 : 09:58:20

talk about a scary windfinder forecast....

http://www.windfinder.com/forecast/southwest_pass

Also, live streaming video from storm chasers here:

http://TVNweather.com/

Do we have any members in the strike zone?

Edited by - on

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