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Swing-keel needed to right a C-25?

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Bruce Baker
Captain

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USA
402 Posts

Initially Posted - 06/16/2003 : 13:32:15

This year, the race committee issued a new rule. They said that boats with swing keels (or centerboards) need to race with the keels/boards down if "the keel is necessary to right the boat after a knockdown".

So what's the deal on a C-25? Does the keel right the boat or not?

I've been sailing with the keel down, but the boat is much slower downwind with the keel down. I'd love to raise it, if I can do so within the rules.

Bruce Baker
Falls Church, VA
"Yee Ha" 3573
'83SR/SK

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John Mason
Admiral

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USA
687 Posts

Response Posted - 06/16/2003 : 17:36:33

Yup, the keel rights the boat after a knock down. Only unweighted (or lightly weighted) swing keels/centerboards would fit the other category.

John Mason
<img src="http://www.users.qwest.net/~jamason/ali.jpg" border=0>
pronounced "Ali Paroosa"
1982 - FK/SR #3290

Edited by - John Mason on 06/16/2003 17:37:07

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Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5909 Posts

Response Posted - 06/16/2003 : 18:27:28

This is a trick question, right? <img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle> If you are sailing with the keel either up or down, and the boat rolls over, the result will be the same, because when the boat rolls over, the keel will retract into the keel trunk. In either case, the self-righting ability of a swinger is dubious.

Seriously, I'm only guessing that an undamaged swinger will slowly right itself, regardless of whether the keel is up or down. But, if the keel was down when the rollover occurred, it's likely that the boat will be severely damaged structurally. When the boat rolls upside down, the 1500# keel will slam into the trunk, and when it rolls back upright, the keel will slam down again. One of those two actions will rip the bottom out of the boat. I used to think that was a horrible weakness on the part of swingers, but, having seen many venerable old C-25 swingers sailing on inland lakes and bays for 20+ years, my thinking has changed. The swinger is designed to be used in inland lakes and small bays and similar protected waters, where it cannot be capsized by big waves. If it's used that way, it will never roll over, and the terrible, theoretical consequence will never occur.

If you are sailing in the kind of protected waters that will insure that the boat will not roll over, then the race committee's rule is probably inapplicable to your boat. If you are sailing in open seas, where waves can build that are capable of capsizing your boat, then their concern about the boat's self-righting qualities is probably pointless.

The skipper (not the race committee) is primarily responsible for the safety of his own boat and crew. If you believe the rule is inapplicable to you (and if you think it is safe to do in your circumstances), then raise your board on the downwind leg, and, if anyone disagrees with you, let them protest. They have to <u>prove</u> that "the keel is necessary to right the boat after a knockdown." The race committee can't just <u>assume</u> that it is necessary. Whether the race committee upholds or overrules the protest, you'll get the answer to your question.

Personally, I'd put a really slippery racing paint on the bottom and keel, to reduce drag to a minimum, and leave it down. Yeeeee Haaaa!

Steve Milby "Captiva Wind" C-25 T/FK #2554

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Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3324 Posts

Response Posted - 06/16/2003 : 19:03:46

Now here's a subject dear to my heart...
There are two considerations with raising the keel when running downwind. One is the safety factor - if you broach then the keel will not be able to right you. (The reason that our C22 swinger sank was that the keel, although in the full "down" position, was not locked down and collapsed as we broached. This left us with no righting moment and she turtled and sank.)
Second, is a rules violation. It is forbidden to "shift ballast" or to do anything that increases or decreases stability during a race and 1,500 lbs of keel sure is ballast! If you don't think raising the keel does either of these, then leave it retracted after you round the leeward mark <img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>...we had a very long discussion on our PHRF Committee a couple of years ago (and there are many years of racing experience and 2 National Champions on the committee). Our final decision was to prohibit keel raising during a race.
Incidentally, the consensus was that raising the keel did not violate the "stability" rule, as you were pretty stable downwind - but lowering it at the leeward mark did violate the rule.
One other reason to prohibit raising the keel on a C25 is that both the fixed and the swing have the same PHRF. The swing is faster to weather, and slower downwind. To allow the swinger to "speed up" downwind would be blatantly unfair - it gives the swinger an advantage in both directions.
Derek

<img src="http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b3dc30b3127cce942c608d6f1e0000001010" border=0>
TRFK#2262"This Side Up"

Edited by - Derek Crawford on 06/16/2003 19:05:45

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Notice: The advice given on this site is based upon individual or quoted experience, yours may differ.
The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.