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Biminis Again

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Dave B
Admiral

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Mali
863 Posts

Initially Posted - 07/18/2003 : 19:15:44

Time to spring for a bimini (mostly for the Admiral's benefit)... I'm pretty well sold on the Olefin or Sharkskin top (over Sunbrella), and probably on a stainless frame (instead of aluminum). Catalina Direct sells a unit that, by its measurements, must attach outside of the coaming, I'm guessing, and seems a little short (up to 36" high). CD mentioned mounting it to the outside of the hull (??)--I guess they mean just above the rub-rail. I'm nervous about exposing the frame to docks, pilings, rafted boats, etc. that way.

At 6' long, I don't see a need to put it on track slides for the genoa track--it'll already cover much of the companionway area.

Did anybody buy CD's unit? Where did you mount it?

If you bought from somewhere else, where and what (size and material)? And where did you mount it?

Thanks!

Dave Bristle, 1985 C-25 #5032 "Passage" SR/FK/Dinette/Honda in SW CT

Edited by - dave b on 07/19/2003 11:01:36

Edited by - on

ddlyle
Captain

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302 Posts

Response Posted - 07/19/2003 : 17:10:12

Dave, I hope you (we) get some responses ... 
I, too, need to buy a bimini and am curious where to mount it. (considering the mainsheet, and the winches on the coaming).
I have a standard rig.
I've wondered the specifications of the Catalina Direct bimini vs. one from West Marine. (but I haven't called CD to get the measurements to compare with West Marine.)

Cap'n Dave
Sailing The Blues
1986 C25 sr/sk #5413

Edited by - on

ronrryan
Admiral

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USA
561 Posts

Response Posted - 07/19/2003 : 17:59:26

There was considerable discussion of biminis in the past, I know because I asked questions on the site. My guess is a search will yield quite a bit of useful info, fair winds, ron srsk Orion SW FL

Edited by - on

Dave B
Admiral

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Mali
863 Posts

Response Posted - 07/19/2003 : 19:07:49

Cap'n Dave: As Ron says, there are a couple of past threads with some info--if you can get the site to find them before it times out. I reviewed a couple (and couldn't get to some others) before posting my questions. I just don't see how Catalina Direct's bimini works on a C-25, although they say it does. (I think they spec'd it for the C-22). I'll probably talk to BoatUS's custom canvas shop about a stainless frame and navy fabric, with enough height to just fit under the standard rig boom.

Even with lines led aft, being able to go forward is an issue for us--I need somebody on a side deck when leaving and entering our slip. That leads to the question of mounting on the coaming or outside of it.

Apparently this topic isn't very interesting... <img src=icon_smile_sleepy.gif border=0 align=middle>

Dave Bristle, 1985 C-25 #5032 "Passage" SR/FK/Dinette/Honda in SW CT

Edited by - on

timpky
1st Mate

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USA
41 Posts

Response Posted - 07/19/2003 : 19:26:36

Your point about being able to go forward with the bimini is very valid. My boat has a bimini that was on it when I purchased it. It is almost impossible to go forward from the cockpit without unhooking the bimini. It is a lifesaver in the sun, but configuration is very important. My configuration is poor, can't go forward and it won't collapse... so I can't help with positive recommendation... but be sure you leave room to go forward. There was a posting on the tech tips http://www.catalina25-250.org/tech/tech25/yahoo1.html regarding using the Genoa track to make your binini adjustable. That looked like it might have some merit... although a challenge regarding having enough places to clip the support straps.

Tim Peoples
Sarasota, FL
78 Catalina 25 SK Hull #875

Edited by - on

jsummerfield
1st Mate

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USA
96 Posts

Response Posted - 07/19/2003 : 20:18:52

A few years ago I contacted a sailmaker about a Bimini for a Catalina 25. They were completely familiar with the Catalina 25 - asking about standard or tall mast. They explained the assorted problems with a Bimini installation on a standard rig. However, I never added the Bimini at that time. We sold the boat and recently reacquired it. I am told that a Bimini is high on the priority list. I plan to contact the sailmaker again. You may want to email them with the question.

C & C Sailmakers
7280 Wynnood Suite 128
Houston, TX 77008
Phone - (713) 862-4456
Toll Free - 1 (800) 950-8474
Fax - (713) 802-1442
E-mail - info@ccsailmakers.com

John
C25 3973 FK/SR
To be renamed "Texas Tango" 26 July 2003

Edited by - on

Buzz Maring
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1771 Posts

Response Posted - 07/19/2003 : 21:23:23

Hi everyone,

I think the best bimini setup I've seen so far is Don Lucier's ... maybe he'll see this thread and comment later. There are two things I like about Don's that make it better than the bimini setup I've got: 1) his frame is attached to cars that slide on the toe rail so he can move his bimini fore and aft, and 2) he can fold it up and tie it to the backstay where it is out of the way when he doesn't need it (I have to fold mine and stow it forward on the cabin top).

My bimini was already installed on my boat when I bought it, so I don't know where it was purchased. Here is how mine is attached:

<img src="http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b3db39b3127cce881568aef7730000001610" border=0>

You can probably tell from the photo that I can't rest the bimini against the backstay because the frame hits the outside of the coaming compartment before the bimini reaches the backstay.

Here is a shot of the bimini looking forward:

<img src="http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b2cc07b3127cce935d30e1af4d0000001610" border=0>

I guess most people would look at the bimini and say it is in the way when going forward, but I really don't have any problem with it ... maybe I'm just used to it. I DO know that I'll never give it up ... that shade is a MUST have for me.

I don't know if this will help y'all or not ... maybe it will give you an idea of what not to do. At any rate, I was starting to feel sorry for y'all languishing in a thread that was getting no attention! <img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>

Buzz Maring
<img src="http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b3df23b3127cce9306a9b3abad0000001010" border=0>
~~Freya~~
C-25 SK/SR #68

Edited by - on

ddlyle
Captain

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302 Posts

Response Posted - 07/19/2003 : 21:24:48

Yes, going forward is important to me since I have a hank on jib.
And I like the idea of mounting on genoa track for ability to slide forward, but am not sure what to buy for the semi-custom installation).

I've thought of going forward by stepping outside of the bimini aft and going around outside (to go forward, as opposed to snaking under the bimini forward).
Does anyone (else) do that? <img src=icon_smile_tongue.gif border=0 align=middle>

Cap'n Dave
Sailing The Blues
1986 C25 sr/sk #5413

Edited by - on

weluvlife
Navigator

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166 Posts

Response Posted - 07/19/2003 : 21:43:36

Hi,

My wife and I are both also interested in purchasing a bimini style sun shade. This thread has my eyes wide open. I like the idea of not having to drill any holes. Also having it mount to the genoa track would be nice.

Mark Eichman
Lake Don Pedro,CA
'86 c25 TR, SK

Edited by - on

Buzz Maring
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1771 Posts

Response Posted - 07/19/2003 : 22:02:35

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
I've thought of going forward by stepping outside of the bimini aft and going around outside (to go forward, as opposed to snaking under the bimini forward).
Does anyone (else) do that? <img src=icon_smile_tongue.gif border=0 align=middle> - Cap'n Dave
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

Hi Dave,

That's what I do, except I step through the "V" made by the two frame members ... you can see them in the photo above ... I just put my foot on the deck and use the bimini frame & lifeline as handholds.

It just dawned on me ... I couldn't do that if the bimini were mounted on the track ... hmmmmmmm ... maybe my installation isn't so bad after all.

Buzz Maring
<img src="http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b3df23b3127cce9306a9b3abad0000001010" border=0>
~~Freya~~
C-25 SK/SR #68

Edited by - buzz maring on 07/19/2003 22:06:52

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 07/20/2003 : 02:28:18

<img src="http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b2d904b3127cce9f7cd9e65e340000001410" border=0>

Yes, as Buzz stated, I mounted my bimini on track cars so I do have the ability to move it along the track. I can fold it up and lash it to the backstay(behind the mainsheet) or move it forward to the cabintop, but in reality I pretty much keep the bimini up and in the same position all season(I can't live without it!).

As far as access to the foredeck from under the bimini, I have three avenues to choose. One, is to squeeze between the bimini frame and the forward hold down strap and walk along the sidedeck, but one needs to be a contortionist to do this. Two, is to simply pop one of the forward hold down straps of the bimini and go forward, which is simple to do. And third, my favorite way to access the foredeck from under the bimini, is to simply step through the companionway, step onto seatback in the cabin(dinette model) and crawl up on the cabintop. I must say you have to be in reasonable shape to do this, but after awhile it is second nature.

<img src="http://www.catalina25-250.org/c25sm.gif" border=0>Don Lucier<img src="http://www.catalina25-250.org/c25sm.gif" border=0>
<img src="http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b2d904b3127cce9f7cd9ffdf1d0000003010" border=0>
North Star SR/FK

Edited by - on

Brooke Willson
Admiral

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USA
983 Posts

Response Posted - 07/20/2003 : 08:04:11

I adore my C25 TR, but I have sadly concluded that it's not designed for a practical bimini. Between the height of the boom and the position of the mainsheet, a bimini just won't work. Yes, I could move the mainsheet to the forward end of the cockpit, but that has its problems. I could mount it on the coachroof, but lose the poptop and the big open companionway. I could recut the sail or special order one . . . you see what I mean. A change in one area means an unacceptable (to me) compromise in another.

Frank Butler, genius that he otherwise is, seems to not have designed this boat for bimini use. Don's configuration is the best I've seen, but he admits its flaws.

So, I've bought a big hat, lots of sunblock (Buzz, it gets plenty hot on the Chesapeake, though not as hot as Texas!), and, when money and emotions permit, I'll tearfully trade my C25 for a C310 with that sexy queen-sized berth in the peak (not to mention a bimini, air-conditioning, and a boom-furling main!)

Brooke

Edited by - on

Sea Trac
Master Marine Consultant

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Vanuatu
1357 Posts

Response Posted - 07/20/2003 : 08:57:07

I'll add my two cents, for what it's worth. My FK/SR had a bimini already installed when I bought the boat. It is mounted six to eight inches forward of where Buzz shows his to be mounted. When up, the forward edge just covers the aft edge of the open companionway hatch.

When I first acquired Antares, the bimini was stowed to fore, and looked to have been there forever. To use the bimini I first had to readjust the sail stops and cunningham, so the main and boom could lift as high as possible while still having proper tension. When the mainsail is down, the topping lift must be raised much higher than usual.

Now that it's configured right, I can stow it fore (ankle breaker) or aft (rests on stern pulpit) while underway, or hang it up on the backstay with bungees while docked. Going forward is very simple with no obstructions created by the frame or the straps. I went SPLASH once trying to go forward by way of the exterior of the bimini; center of gravity displaced outside the gunwales and the material and frame were too lightweight to provide adequate counter force.

I don't know exact dimensions, but the boom justs rests on top when the mainsail is up and the mainsheet is hauled in as tight as possible. Forward edge extends to aft edge of open companionway, and aft edge extends just shy of the end of the boom. Gunwale to gunwale for width, with the mounts dead center (i.e., fore/aft and port/starboard) in the small area of deck space beside the cockpit. Sunbrella material that is still like new after 15 years, thanks to bimini cover, and an aluminum frame with nylon fittings. I would HIGHLY recommend a stainless frame with stainless fittings.

J.B. Manley, Antares '86 FK/SR #4849
Grand Lake O' The Cherokees, NE Oklahoma

Edited by - on

Dave B
Admiral

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Mali
863 Posts

Response Posted - 07/20/2003 : 15:10:46

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
...And third, my favorite way to access the foredeck from under the bimini, is to simply step through the companionway, step onto seatback in the cabin(dinette model) and crawl up on the cabintop. I must say you have to be in reasonable shape to do this, but after awhile it is second nature.
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>
For you young turks, of course! For me, maybe... For the Admiral, not a chance! I'm thinking a quick-release forward strap may solve the problem.

JB: I suspect yours is 4' long (2 bows) rather than the more popular 6' (3 bows) that partially covers the companionway. The smaller size probably helps for access forward, but I'm probably headed toward a six-footer with a stainless frame, although the SS is apparently about $220 more... <img src=icon_smile_sad.gif border=0 align=middle>

Thanks for the discussions so far--it looks like I have a few fellow shade-seekers. I'll recommend also searching on topics with "bimini" in the title--there are some threads from last year. A guy could get a sunburn over-analyzing this thing... <img src=icon_smile_blush.gif border=0 align=middle>

Dave Bristle, 1985 C-25 #5032 "Passage" SR/FK/Dinette/Honda in SW CT

Edited by - on

skipn809
Navigator

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111 Posts

Response Posted - 07/20/2003 : 16:27:13

If anybody should have a good solution to the diminsions and location of a bimini for a tall rig, please advise. I plan to move the main sheet to the cabin top, and I can already see it will be a tight fit. Thanks.

Skip 1985 C-25 T/R #5121 "Corporal Punishment" N.E. Mo.

Edited by - on

Brooke Willson
Admiral

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USA
983 Posts

Response Posted - 07/20/2003 : 19:46:36

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>Now that it's configured right, I can stow it fore (ankle breaker) or aft (rests on stern pulpit) while underway, or hang it up on the backstay with bungees while docked. <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

I don't understand. How do your get it through the backstay(s)? Or have you installed a boomkin and moved the backstay six feet aft?

Brooke

Edited by - on

Dave B
Admiral

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Mali
863 Posts

Response Posted - 07/20/2003 : 20:47:36

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
I don't understand. How do your get it through the backstay(s)? Or have you installed a boomkin and moved the backstay six feet aft?
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>
Brooke: Take a look at Don's photo above... I think you can imagine how his bimini could fold back and lie on the sides of the stern rail--without being stopped by the mainsheet or backstay. That would be inconvenient for me, since we board at the transom in our slip, but it could be useful to somebody.

Dave Bristle, 1985 C-25 #5032 "Passage" SR/FK/Dinette/Honda in SW CT

Edited by - on

Sea Trac
Master Marine Consultant

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Vanuatu
1357 Posts

Response Posted - 07/20/2003 : 21:55:02

Dave and Brooke - The photo of Don's rig is representative of mine. However, my bimini is about two feet longer (Dave, mine has the fore and aft frames, plus two more that bow up the center). So, it comes forward about another two feet, but ends aft about where Don's does. Probably more than you want to know about someone else's bimini.

Also, mine is mounted further forward, so when stowed aft the main frame clears the coamings and when stowed forward it clears (reads hangs up) the main hatch. Whereas, it looks as if Don's version can't tilt any further back and must be stowed forward or hanging from the backstay.

I'll get pictures this week or next weekend, if anyone's interested.

J.B. Manley, Antares '86 FK/SR #4849
Grand Lake O' The Cherokees, NE Oklahoma

Edited by - on

Dave B
Admiral

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Mali
863 Posts

Response Posted - 07/20/2003 : 23:29:41

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
I'll get pictures this week or next weekend, if anyone's interested.

J.B. Manley
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>
I certainly am, JB. Thanks!

Dave Bristle, 1985 C-25 #5032 "Passage" SR/FK/Dinette/Honda in SW CT

Edited by - on

Brooke Willson
Admiral

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USA
983 Posts

Response Posted - 07/21/2003 : 00:58:16

Oh. It's outside the lifelines, isn't it? Duh.

Brooke

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ddlyle
Captain

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302 Posts

Response Posted - 07/21/2003 : 09:26:43

J.B.
Thanks for the offer (of the photo) ... I am interested to see
other solutions.

I still don't know what kind of piece to buy for the genoa
car track that the bimini frame would attach to.

I guess I could ask the guys at West Marine.

Cap'n Dave
Sailing The Blues
1986 C25 sr/sk #5413

Edited by - on

Sea Trac
Master Marine Consultant

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Vanuatu
1357 Posts

Response Posted - 07/21/2003 : 09:59:08

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
I still don't know what kind of piece to buy for the genoa
car track that the bimini frame would attach to.
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

Most genoa track mounted biminis that I've seen utilize a regular genoa car with the roller removed and the bimini mounting fixture installed in the roller's place. Although, IMHO that set-up will interfere with your actual genoa car's function. My genoa car must come all the way back parallel with the coamings winches to properly tension the foot of my 155%.

Yes, Brooke, I failed to mention that I run the lifelines inside the frame when the bimini is up, stowed aloft or stowed aft. To stow forward, the lifelines need to be run outside the frame. However, I never do this any more, because I got tired of pulverizing my ankles going forward. I removed my "Catalina 25" logos, as well, after tearing the skin off both ankles half a dozen times.

I'll get and post pictures of my set-up this week.

J.B. Manley, Antares '86 FK/SR #4849
Grand Lake O' The Cherokees, NE Oklahoma

Edited by - on

timpky
1st Mate

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USA
41 Posts

Response Posted - 07/21/2003 : 20:18:16

I am surprised there was no comment here from Patrick regarding the bimini on Lucky Star. His set up looked pretty good. http://www.proxycreative.com/luckystar_extpics.html

Tim Peoples
Sarasota, FL
78 Catalina 25 SK Hull #875

Edited by - on

Dave B
Admiral

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Mali
863 Posts

Response Posted - 07/21/2003 : 21:57:17

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
I am surprised there was no comment here from Patrick regarding the bimini on Lucky Star. His set up looked pretty good. http://www.proxycreative.com/luckystar_extpics.html
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>
I notice that Lucky Star's bimini is mounted on top of the coamings, just forward and inside of the winches. It looks like it may be more difficult to maneuver around to go forward than the side-deck or track mounts, but I'm not sure... What I do know is the sun was HOT yesterday!

Dave Bristle, 1985 C-25 #5032 "Passage" SR/FK/Dinette/Honda in SW CT

Edited by - on

Dave
Deckhand

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Response Posted - 07/22/2003 : 14:50:29

I have a bimini that looks about the same size as Don's. I also prefer the method of jumping on top of the cabin from the campanionway with the cabin top slid forward about a foot or so. I've tried going outside and would either splash or break the alumimum supports if I lost my balance. The other option is to to through the front hatch. I have a headsail furler but jump up to the mast to drop the main and jiffy reef. I can do this single-handing using a tiller tamer without any problems, but if it is especially windy out I usually don't sail with the bimini up so I can move faster and see better. I'm in Montana so it usually isn't too hot out (except lately we are breaking records). My bimini folds forward which decreases my forward view slightly, but that can be fixed by sitting on a cushion or two.

Dave
<img src="http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b3db37b3127cce88634d60e09b0000001010" border=0>
Montana Spirit
1980 C25 SR/SK

Edited by - on

skipn809
Navigator

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111 Posts

Response Posted - 07/22/2003 : 19:55:11

You might want to try this site for a bimini. I am considering buying from them. I was impressed by a friend's.
http//www.gmitopdesign.com/f-english.html?

Skip 1985 C-25 T/R #5121 "Corporal Punishment" N.E. Mo.

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