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Keel bolt question

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Doug C.
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USA
146 Posts

Initially Posted - 10/13/2003 : 14:02:44

Cleaned the bilge this weekend. Noticed the nut and washer on one of the keel bolts is pretty rusty. Do I need to buy some type of extra deep socket to get it off for replacement? Didn't seem like there is enough room for a wrench. When I replace it how tight should I crank it down?

Thanks!

Doug Cavin
1990 C25 TR/WK #6010
"Valkyrie"

Edited by - Doug C. on 10/13/2003 14:03:50

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JimB517
Past Commodore

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USA
3285 Posts

Response Posted - 10/13/2003 : 17:12:19

having sistered my bolts and replaced everything on the keel bolts, I have some experience on this job.

I think your bolts are 3/4 inch (my new ones are). You'll need a deep socket, extensions, and a breaker bar (special long handled rachet). Everything is available at Home Depot. Feel the bolts with a cresent wrench or box wrench to make sure you get the right size socket.

How hard to tighten them? My keel man said "as tight as you can get them".

<img src="http://www.indiscipline.org/cat25/pictures/icon.jpg" border=0>Indiscipline 1978 FK #398

Edited by - on

cch
Navigator

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202 Posts

Response Posted - 10/13/2003 : 23:29:38

Hi Doug,

We are in the process of conveting from swing to wing keel. Our new keel from Catalina came with 5/8" bolts and the instructions said to torque them to 50 lbs.

I don't know what keel you have, or what vintage. Perhaps this will help?

Chris Hunsicker
Panama City FL
Moonglade
80 C25 #2126 sr/sk
<img src="http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b3d636b3127cce8c9d4c83e7890000002010" border=0>

Edited by - on

Douglas
Master Marine Consultant

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1595 Posts

Response Posted - 10/14/2003 : 00:42:16

Only one bad bolt. If its not to bad clean it up and leave it alone. Put some protection on it . Catalina often mixed their hardware so you might have a regular steel washer or nut or both. Test them to find out. Use a magnet. If its magnetic its not good stainless.

Doug&Ruth
Triska (Alberg 29)
Tacoma Wa.

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dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 10/14/2003 : 12:47:27

Check out this SailNet article from yesterday.

[url="http://www.sailnet.com/collections/articles/index.cfm?articleid=caseyd0039%20%20&tfr=fp"]Keel Bolt Concerns[/url]

<img src="http://www.catalina25-250.org/c25sm.gif" border=0>Don Lucier<img src="http://www.catalina25-250.org/c25sm.gif" border=0>
<img src="http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b2d904b3127cce9f7cd9ffdf1d0000003010" border=0>
North Star SR/FK

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dgabel
1st Mate

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USA
75 Posts

Response Posted - 10/14/2003 : 17:47:54

I checked this with Catalina, as I have rusty keel bolts.

Catalina has an alternate to the factory system, which is bolts threaded into transverse 1.25-in. rod in the keel. They suggest 10-in. stainless lag bolts, which you can buy from them for $19.20 each.

Of course, you'd have to drill into the keel, and torque the lag bolts in.

Dave Gabel
Walkure
Hull 1484

Edited by - on

deastburn
Captain

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USA
334 Posts

Response Posted - 10/15/2003 : 13:46:36

Dave: Thanks for the info. I also have rusty keel bolts and promised myself last Spring I would do something about them this fall. From what you say, it sound like one drills a transverse hole in the keel from the outside for the rod, and then a hole down into the keel through the fiberglas keelson from inside the boat. I cannot imagine how one gets those to line up. Nor am I clear how one threads stainless steel rod into those holes (or perhaps Catalina's bolts have a way of attaching a wrench?).

Has anyone out there recently replaced their keel bolts? I seem to remember a thread on this with photos earlier this year, but I can't find it now.

Dave on "Wood Duck" (#2616 - SR, FK)

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deastburn
Captain

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USA
334 Posts

Response Posted - 10/15/2003 : 13:46:57

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JimB517
Past Commodore

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USA
3285 Posts

Response Posted - 10/15/2003 : 15:33:23

I replaced my bolts when I bought the boat. 3/4 inch holes were bored in the cast iron keel alongside the old, wasted, bolts. This took about 1 day per hole. A special drill press was used (with the pop-top up) and carbide bits were used. Threads were tapped, then new stainless studs were threaded down. Finally, nuts and washers were screwed down on the studs. The old bolts were treated with carbolic acid and then sealed with bitumen.

I had this specialized work done. It cost $900 and took about 2 weeks. 6 new 3/4 inch stainless bolts were inserted to a depth of about 6 inches into the keel. All the old bolts are still in (and sealed). I never had any leaks, just bad rust.

This can not be done with the lead keels.

<img src="http://www.indiscipline.org/cat25/pictures/icon.jpg" border=0>Indiscipline 1978 FK #398

Edited by - on

dgabel
1st Mate

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USA
75 Posts

Response Posted - 10/15/2003 : 17:51:47

I got a drawing from Catalina that shows two different kinds of keel installations. One uses the threaded rod combo. There's a threaded cylinder in the keel that's perpendicular to the vertical centerline of the keel, and this cylinder has a threaded hole in it. Then a threaded rod (the keel bolt) threads down into the cylinder. That makes the fastening system.

The alternate is a stainless lag screw, 1/2 in. by 10 in. In my case, I'd leave the existing keel bolts in place and seal them, and put new lag screws in along side, "sistering" the existing keel bolts, as Jim did on Indiscipline.

But there may be problems. I thought my keel was iron or steel, not lead, and the drawing shows a lead casting. I don't think lag bolts would thread into iron. Also, I have no idea how hard it would be to drill a 1/2-in hole into the keel to take the lag screws. I have a message back to Catalina to get the answer to that question. In the meantime, I used Rust-oleum primer and finish paint to attempt to reduce corrosion, but I'm sure they're corroded inside the keel as well. So I have to do something, or the keel is going to start moving on me. Fortunately, I don't have any cracks at the keel joint, so it seems to be holding pretty well for now.

If my keel is iron, drilling those holes is beyond my capability, so I'll have to investigate the material, and then try to find someone who can handle the drilling chore.

Dave Gabel
Walkure
Sail # 1484

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JimB517
Past Commodore

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USA
3285 Posts

Response Posted - 10/15/2003 : 20:20:03

I was told that lead will not hold the threads, but the cast iron keel will. However, it took special equipment to bore and tap the holes. The cast iron is very hard and heat builds up. The holes have to be straight.

My keel man used a special drill press, with the pop-top up, and some boards across the boat. This is a job you want to contract out to an experienced pro. If you're in the Los Angeles area I can give you the name and number.

Now I have 6 new bolts plus the old ones holding the keel. I don't ever have to worry about it.

<img src="http://www.indiscipline.org/cat25/pictures/keelbolts.jpg" border=0>

<img src="http://www.indiscipline.org/cat25/pictures/icon.jpg" border=0>Indiscipline 1978 FK #398

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The Officers, Staff and members of this site only provide information based upon the concept that anyone utilizing this information does so at their own risk and holds harmless all contributors to this site.