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Heads ... yay

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Waterboy
Navigator

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USA
204 Posts

Initially Posted - 04/23/2004 : 14:24:54

Some projects are more fun than others, and in the interest of averting a mutiny incited by the First Mate, it's clear that some plumbing upgrades are in odor ... er, 'order'. Left to my own devices I'd go with the racing toilet (bucket, roll of garbage bags, and horseshoe), but the crew (aka First Mate) demands and deserves better accomodations, and has issued the decree: "A toilet that will flush is to be installed and found properly functioning prior to any excursion exceeding 24 hours."

There are numerous resources on how to design and assemble a system incorporating this modern convenience, Arlyn's installation being one excellent example. Yet I have a few questions ...

- the surprisingly wide selection of toilets ranges in price from a little over $100 to over $1000. What do I really need? I don't want a gilded throne; I want a reliable, comfortable head I can install myself. Anyone have positive or negative recommendations regarding brands, features, etc.?

- I'd like the simplest design possible ... or perhaps practical. Any recommendations in this regard would be appreciated.

- I've been looking at WM, iBoat, and Marisafe. Any other sources of info and equipment I should look at.

- Have I missed any significant threads here addressing this?

As always, Thanks in advance!

Greg

Edited by - on

cathluk
Admiral

Members Avatar

USA
513 Posts

Response Posted - 04/23/2004 : 15:38:00

I would recommend a Port-o-potty rather than a full marine head. Fewer potential problems & if you can't get a pump-out you can always dump it yourself. We can get by for almost a week with ours.

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 04/23/2004 : 16:18:47

Greg,

If I didn't have access to a pump out facilty, I'd do as Cathy suggested and go with a quality Port-a-Potty for the ease of use, but if you do have access to a pumpout station then I'd go with the fixed marine head.

Another consideration is your type of sailing. If you go gunkholing for a week or two with a crew of four, then you might need something with a large capacity. If you are singlehanded daysailing, then the port-o-potty might be a good choice.

What is your preference?

Edited by - on

Oscar
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2030 Posts

Response Posted - 04/23/2004 : 16:32:18

Second the carry-a-can. Here's why...(I have had both on different boats....)

The smaller the boat, the bigger the loss of space with a marine head installation. Unless premium ($$$) materials are used, the odor of the load (

) will sooner or later permiate the plastic. Junior WILL create something that won't flush, straight up or sideways. He'll do this either at 3am, or in the middle of the bay with 25 knots gusting 30. If you think that's bad, imagine him flushing something that get's stuck and requires disassembly. My father was a tough cookie, but I remember truly feeling sorry for him when he had to take the thing apart, off shore, after my brother......

Lady Kay came with a 1 gallon PP.(

) I removed that right away and replaced it with a six gallon Pot, capital P. (West Marine $65 or so) I get sent ashore for anything other than a midnight whizz, and with that it lasts us 4-5 days. With a double dose of green stuff in there the thing is odor free, period. I empty it during the morning beer sh&t rush hour in a marina, when the mens room is a super fund site anyways, and no one notices, or cares.

Furthermore, and this is important, our boats spend 90% of the time without anyone on them, buttoned up, and half of that baking in the sun. With a holding tank you open the hatch after a week you are greeted by a waft of lingering..

..unless you do as I do and take the PP off, fill it with water and some bleach and park it in the garage.....no source, no odor.

If the thing after two years gets a little

you chuck it and buy a new one.

If the FM needs corroborating testimony, the Admiral will certify the above to be true, and she's a picky girl...(that's why she married me

)

Oscar, on the road.

Edited by - Oscar on 04/23/2004 16:35:44

Doug C.
Navigator

Members Avatar

USA
146 Posts

Response Posted - 04/23/2004 : 17:08:50

I have a Jabsco Compact Manual head (factory installation). Works good. Replaced what I assume was the original last year. I had put a re-build kit in the original the year prior, the kit cost $50 should have just replaced the whole unit then.

Easy to work on, can be torn apart at sea (don't ask why I know this

). Currently on sale at WM for $109.

It is possible to have a marine head and no odors. We have found that if we just dump it frequently, use good chems, and flush with fresh water if possible (even using salt for flushing it is not a problem, salt water just grows stuff quicker), odors are not a problem.

My first mate is very happy with our setup. If odors were bad she would have me ripping it out.

Ultimately you should do what best fits your needs. I just wanted to share that we have been using a marine head without the odor issues or significant problems. No more of an issue than the portapotti we use in our Windrose.

Edited by - Doug C. on 04/23/2004 17:11:25

Waterboy
Navigator

Members Avatar

USA
204 Posts

Response Posted - 04/23/2004 : 17:27:28

Well, the developing consensus seems to favor the portapottie. Here's an article titled "In Praise of the Humble Porta Pottie" http://www.pocketcruisers.com/art_portapotti.html I certainly find the ease of installation appealing, so ... more research to find the 'best' one. WM's selection includes a SaniPottie with a 'sanitation hose fitting', and there's the (considerably more expensive) 'Traveler Marine Sanitation System'. Does anyone have experience with either of these? I find the possibility of pumping out the portable (as opposed to lugging the jug) quite appealing.

My twisted little mind also can't help but wonder what the Japanese and French have come up with in contrast to we simple pragmatic Americans.

'just trying to keep it light! Thanks All!

Edited by - on

Raskal
Navigator

Members Avatar

USA
162 Posts

Response Posted - 04/23/2004 : 17:34:40

If you're thinking of going with a permanent throne the "hoity toity" of manual heads is the vacuum-action Lavac ($400):

http://www.defender.com/cgi-bin/Web_store/web_store.cgi?page=cat_plumbing.html&frames=yes&store=yes

It seems like there are about 50 other models by other makers that all cost about $120 and all look like they work the same way. I think a fine point here is making sure the y-valve and through-hull set up are a straight and downhill shot to the through-hull. I can't quite figure out why no one positions that through-hull directly UNDER the head...

Rich K.

Edited by - on

OJ
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 04/23/2004 : 20:14:16

The nice part about a portable pottie with the pump-out option is it will satisfy Canada's regs regarding permanent heads - at least the last time we were sailing there . . .

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 04/23/2004 : 21:14:30

Greg: I have the 5-gallon SaniPotti, and it's very good. I got it to replace a 1-gallon version, which is not sufficient for 2 people over 2 days. The SaniPotti is tight enough that you should make sure you open the slide valve slightly before putting anything in the bowl, to relieve the pressure that builds in the holding tank. Otherwise,

!! It clamps tightly in place (another important feature) and has a nice sitting height. Considering all the issues (installation, cleaning, pumping out, repairing or re-plumbing, and potentially syphoning water into the boat), the only advantage to the fixed heads I've used is capacity. I like my Sani.

Edited by - on

Arlyn Stewart
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2980 Posts

Response Posted - 04/23/2004 : 23:28:15

OJ... I don't know that the law is directly enforced in Canada, but I've witnessed that it is indirectly done by posting of signs in some restrooms. NO DUMPING OF PORTIE POTTIES

The Trailer Sailors group has a large gathering who cruise together every summer and usually put in at Spanish, Ontario. The group coordinator received a letter from the Harbor Master relevant to the upcoming cruise this summer and was advised that someone had emptied a portie potty in the marina restroom last year and he was reminding them that porti potties are not to be emptied in the restroom.

Folks, this is only being courteous... emptying a portie potty in a closed restroom is not friendly to others using the facility. Consider purchasing a porti pottie with a pump out adapter and empty if possible at the pump out station or take it home.

Edited by - on

Gloss
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1916 Posts

Response Posted - 04/24/2004 : 08:11:19

I have a porta potti with the electric motor for flushing instead of a pump. Works very well, and has a large capacity. The throne is also larger, which is nice. The really cheap porta pottis are really small and that can cause a multitude of discomforts. It came with hold down clips to keep it from moving when heeled. Not all porta pottis have this.

I also use a chemical called Odorlos. It breaks down the waste instead of using perfumes and formaldahyde like the blue stuff does. It smells a lot less, even when not dumping out the tank for a while.

I also have a Marinco fan mounted above the toilet area

Edited by - on

ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

3072 Posts

Response Posted - 04/24/2004 : 10:35:54

Good thread.. I'm pondering head replacement myself...

Frank, do you have the Thetford 875? It looks like the choices
are either one of that series or the Sanipotti. The thetford looks
like it might be a little better built than the Sanipotti, but it's
hard to tell from the pictures.

The Thetford 875 is available in both dump and pump models... as is the Sanipotti.

What would be nice is a model that would easily let you switch between
the two modes with some sort of quick-disconnect fitting and valve.

The Sanipotti says it has a 1-1/2" fitting and vent hose... but it
doesn't say that the system is really suitiable for direct pump-out..
the ad copy talks about going to a seacock or holding tank.

Anyone know if either of the above can be easily configured
as a "pump or dump" system or done same with external plumbing?

Edited by - on

Buzz Maring
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1772 Posts

Response Posted - 04/24/2004 : 10:37:43

I have a porta potti with the electric motor for flushing instead of a pump. - Frank

Hi Frank,

That's an interesting feature ... where does the electrical power come from? Is it battery powered, or is it wired into the boat's DC electrical system?

Does it have a large capacity? ... 'a pump-out capability?

Thanks!

Edited by - on

Gloss
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
1916 Posts

Response Posted - 04/24/2004 : 10:57:11

OK, I took a break from cutting the grass and yardwork to look this up.
My electric porta potti is the Aquamate MSD Marine Head. It is powered by AA batteries. Look in www.boatus.com and it is catalog number 2239143.

It is the largest porta potti I found, and good for folks like me with a big butt and full of

Like I said before, buy some Odorlos chemical, no matter what brand you use. Less smell.

Edited by - on

Bryan Beamer
Master Marine Consultant

Members Avatar

USA
1038 Posts

Response Posted - 04/26/2004 : 20:02:48

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Gloss
 Like I said before, buy some Odorlos chemical, no matter what brand you use. Less smell.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Second on the Odorlos. We use it on the boat and the 5th wheel. It is by far the best stuff I have used.

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

Members Avatar

Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 04/26/2004 : 23:09:34

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Gloss
 
My electric porta potti is the Aquamate MSD Marine Head. It is powered by AA batteries. Look in www.boatus.com and it is catalog number 2239143.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Thanks Frank, ordered it to replace the 135 midget.

Edited by - on

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