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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Catalina 25 Specific Forum

pop top and sailing

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gmcdent
1st Mate

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USA
41 Posts

Initially Posted - 08/29/2004 : 19:00:47

I would like to know if there is any problem sailing with the pop top open provided conditions are not severe or on a run or broad reach. Can it come crashing down?

Thanks

George C. on At Last

Edited by - on

Lightnup
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1016 Posts

Response Posted - 08/29/2004 : 19:47:26

These folks (whom I hope don't mind me using their picture..it's also part of my screen saver

)are sailing with the pop-top up. There seems to be a boom-vang missing, though.

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 08/29/2004 : 20:08:53

For safety reasons I recommend being very judicious about when you choose to do it and only do it after you have installed the pneumatic strut supports from Catalinadirect.com

[url="http://www.catalinadirect.com/power%20lift%20kit1.html"]strut[/url]

Edited by - on

Brooke Willson
Admiral

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USA
983 Posts

Response Posted - 08/29/2004 : 21:53:25

I've motored on hot windless days with the top up, when I wasn't worried about moving around on the deck adjusting rigging, and didn't need to use the boom vang. There's a latch that holds the top to the mast, although I wouldn't test it against my weight. I don't think I would really sail with the top up, because I might have to change course, deal with changing weather conditions, etc.

Brooke

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 08/29/2004 : 22:10:05

Certainly make sure you use the locking slider that fits in the mast slot. If you don't have one, Catalina Direct does. Use it even in your slip or at anchor--the design of the top does not let it lean as far forward to the mast as it probably should, so a small boat wake could cause it to hurt someone. Under sail, you might want to add a line around the mast from the tops of the forward legs. In any chop, just leave it down. If you don't have Catalina Direct's gas struts, it can be really dangerous.

I'll add the opinion that having it up detracts from visibility from the windward side toward the leeward foward quadrant, which is already somewhat obstructed in a sailboat.

BTW, that picure is in, what, 4" seas? I have no idea what it's like to sail in that.

Edited by - Dave Bristle on 08/29/2004 22:14:36

gmcdent
1st Mate

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USA
41 Posts

Response Posted - 08/30/2004 : 06:26:43

You guys are great! I had no idea about the pneumatic lifts. They sure would make life easier. Thanks again.

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ddlyle
Captain

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302 Posts

Response Posted - 08/30/2004 : 22:02:45

Instead of installing pneumatic lifts, (which I thought
weren't necessary given the weight) ...
you can always use my friend the bungie.
I've had the wing-nut style lock in the mast slot come loose.
Bungies are cheaper and easier to install than pneumatic lifts.

Edited by - on

Ed Montague
Captain

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USA
499 Posts

Response Posted - 08/31/2004 : 15:42:42

ddlyle, How do you rig bungie cord to help lift the poptop to the up position? I can't picture this in my mind.

We sail with the poptop up often in the summer, haven't noticed any reduction in view, the 150 pretty much blocks the view.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 08/31/2004 : 17:06:26

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Ed Montague
 ddlyle, How do you rig bungie cord to help lift the poptop to the up position? I can't picture this in my mind.

We sail with the poptop up often in the summer, haven't noticed any reduction in view, the 150 pretty much blocks the view.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
I think Dave Lyle is speaking of something to hold it up, not something to lift it. I think a bungee is questionable as a safety line--if the top decides to come down, a bungee is probably going to let it do so, possibly after stretching to its breaking point, which can be scary all by itself. A piece of rope would be better. Whatever you do, be careful--there have been some stories here about tops coming down and people getting hurt. I'd never sail with it up on Long Island Sound--a small lake with no big wakes might be OK. The gas struts might change my mind.

Edited by - on

Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3321 Posts

Response Posted - 08/31/2004 : 18:26:42

I never trusted that little hook (now I use it as a stopper for the gooseneck) so I cut 2 pieces of 2 x 4 of the appropriate length, cut a U-slot at one end and a V-slot at the other. Now we hoist the pop-top and insert the blocks - no possible chance of a sudden collapse.

Derek

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Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 08/31/2004 : 21:56:59

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Derek Crawford
 ...I cut 2 pieces of 2 x 4 of the appropriate length, cut a U-slot at one end and a V-slot at the other. Now we hoist the pop-top and insert the blocks - no possible chance of a sudden collapse.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Derek: I guess I'm a little slow tonight (or genrally)... Can you expand on the placement of your 2x4s?

Edited by - on

Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3321 Posts

Response Posted - 08/31/2004 : 23:19:38

Sure Dave! The U-shaped end fits over the edge of the cabin top and the V-shaped piece holds the thin underside edge of the pop up. I place them just in front of the cabin end of the struts.
They don't look as nice as the gas struts, but they sure are a heck of a lot cheaper!!

(It's the KISS principle again...

)
Derek

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 09/01/2004 : 07:51:48

My struts were bought during a period of new owner bliss where I was pretty much buying everything I could find. They seemed a little expensive but a good idea. After I installed them I was EXTREMELY impressed with the installation kit and the functionality of the struts. They are amazing, and you will have a lot of confidence that the top won't come down because of the angle of the opened strut. I person would have to be a complete idiot to have a top open in the kind of seaway that could cause the top to shut against the struts.

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Buzz Maring
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1768 Posts

Response Posted - 09/01/2004 : 07:59:38

... After I installed them I was EXTREMELY impressed with the installation kit and the functionality of the struts. They are amazing ... - Frank

I totally agree with Frank ... they are a bit pricey, but worth every penny.

Edited by - on

Dave Bristle
Master Marine Consultant

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Djibouti
10005 Posts

Response Posted - 09/01/2004 : 10:11:33

Am I correct in recalling that the mast should be down to install the struts (so the top can be swung further forward)? You have me thinking about a Spring project...

Edited by - on

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 09/01/2004 : 11:04:32

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Dave Bristle
 Am I correct in recalling that the mast should be down to install the struts (so the top can be swung further forward)? You have me thinking about a Spring project...
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I am so old and fay that I recall forming an opinion as to whether or not the suggested method (no mast) was necessary or not, but do not recall my conclusion. As with all pneumatics, it is a question of being strong enough to compress the strut. I do Bilstein struts on my vehicles and use cord to hold them closed while I move them into place. I would not be afraid to buy the units now and try to do it with the mast up. One issue, do not raise it with the mast down without some one on the deck to keep it from flopping forward.

Edited by - on

Buzz Maring
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1768 Posts

Response Posted - 09/01/2004 : 11:37:40

... Am I correct in recalling that the mast should be down to install the struts (so the top can be swung further forward)? - Dave

Hi Dave,

Yes, the recommended procedure is to have the mast down ... this allows the poptop to slide forward enough to preload the struts.

... I am so old and fay that I recall forming an opinion as to whether or not the suggested method (no mast) was necessary or not, but do not recall my conclusion. - Frank

Frank ... I seem to recall that you figured out a way to compress the struts without taking down the mast ... 'too bad you're getting so senile you can't remember!

I'll do a search for that thread, and I'll post a link if I can find it ... don't get your hopes up though, Dave ... the "search" function on this Forum and I have NEVER gotten along.

Let me see if I can find it ...

edit: After a sold half hour of searching I've come up with nothing ... did I mention that I HATE the search function on this Forum?!

Edited by - Buzz Maring on 09/01/2004 12:09:41

ddlyle
Captain

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302 Posts

Response Posted - 09/01/2004 : 21:00:34

I don't think the pop top is too heavy to lift.
My thoughts on the bungee method follow:
Once it is up, it requires very little forward pressure to keep it up.
No upward lift, only a little forward pressure to keep it propped against the tall thing (er uh mast, sorry)
So a beefy bungie (like a heavy black one used by truckers) works well to apply moderate forward pressure against the mast.
Dave

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