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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Catalina 250 Specific Forum

Reefin'

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chris wray
Deckhand

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USA
22 Posts

Initially Posted - 09/11/2004 : 13:56:02

Hello all,
We sail 250WK #421 on SF Bay and it took a long time to perfect reefing and we are still working on it. Troubles we were having once we got past getting the jiffy rigging to work somewhat smoothly was sail shape. Here we had a reef tucked in (and an ugly one at that) but the sail was too deep and thus powerful and thus negating, to a large degree, what we were hoping to accomplish by reefing. We had tried to flatten the sail and make better looking (as in ship- shape-we-look-like-we-know-what-we-are-doing) the boom by tieing the reef points but it looked like a bulging sack of potatoes and the strain that was apparent at the reef points was scary (as in might need new sail cause the old one ripped at the reef points).
What we do now is to be sure the outhaul is taught before dropping the sail down and then we fasten, with a tie, the clew of the sail to the back of the boom (reinforcing what the jiffy rigging tries to do but does so poorly). This insures that the sail's shape is flat and the bunching is now a neat looking fold along the boom and we are not tieing off the reef points either.
Have we discovered what everyone here has been doing for years? Or are we still not getting 100% from the jiffy rigging?
Thanks,
Chris Wray

Edited by - on

aeckhart
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1709 Posts

Response Posted - 09/12/2004 : 11:38:39

Looks to me like your doing what you can to optimize sail shape in a siutation that is tough to deal with. Do you have a loose-footed main? I switched to one last year on my C25 tall rig. The foot gathers better on the boom than my previous stock sail. I'm looking forward to using my second reef

, so I can see how it gathers over the first.

Al
GALLIVANT
C25T #5801

Edited by - aeckhart on 09/12/2004 11:39:19

Arlyn Stewart
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2980 Posts

Response Posted - 09/12/2004 : 13:18:06

Chirs,

The Catalina jiffy reefing settup on the c250 is poorly designed. A poorly designed system cannot be made to work effectively, its that simply.

The fix is also simple....double line reefing.

Edited by - on

reuben
Navigator

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USA
202 Posts

Response Posted - 09/12/2004 : 22:55:20

The first half of the season we tried using the single-line system, but it was difficult to use and pretty ineffective in terms of sail shape. Then in July we lost the line itself inside the boom (don't ask why I untied the stopknot - the clear answer is idiocy) and ever since we've reefed with two lines. It's easier (though I haven't yet tried it singlehanded) and makes a cleaner more efficient reef. We won't return to the single-line method.

Edited by - on

Alan Therrien
Navigator

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USA
113 Posts

Response Posted - 09/13/2004 : 18:36:19

I'm siding with Arlyn and Rueben on this one.

I got myself a mast gate, so i can pull the tack all the way down to the mast without having to remove the sail slug stopper (not needed with mast gate). And I went to a second set of lines for the clew, by installing a couple of small turning blocks on the mast and a small cleat. The wife and I can now quickly and cleanly set either of the two reefing points in minutes. Looks good. Works good.

These changes were not my original ideas. Both the mast gate and clew reefing arrangements were found in earlier threads on this web site. I highly recommend the changes.

Alan Therrien
C250K #418
"Moonpenny"

Edited by - on

Keith D.
Navigator

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USA
233 Posts

Response Posted - 09/14/2004 : 00:37:26

I tried the factory jiffy reefing setup on my boat one time. What I ended up with was a sail, which was too deep and thus powerful and thus negating. That was the first and the only time I used the jiffy reefing setup. I have also gone to the two-line system with a mast gate. I am still having trouble getting the tac down to the boom but it is at least possible. With the original system it isn’t. The clue is cleated off at the end of the boom. And if set right you don’t need or want the sail ties. Save your self-time and frustration, go to the two line system. The jiffy reefing system is just for the sales brochures. Looks good but doesn’t work.

Edited by - on

Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3321 Posts

Response Posted - 09/14/2004 : 09:12:05

Can someone (maybe the C250 Guru, Arlyn!) explain why the jiffy reefing (one line) system works so well on a C25, but all the 250 owners say it doesn't work...??? Just curious.
Derek

Edited by - on

Arlyn Stewart
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2980 Posts

Response Posted - 09/14/2004 : 10:22:54

Derek, the prime reason is likely that the c250 uses internal vs external routing for the factory designed settup.

External routing for a jiffy reef includes two cheek blocks with each making a 90 deg transfer. The line also incurs two 180 deg grommet transfers as well as a mast base turning block, and deck organizer if led to the cockpit. Formible, yet doable.

The 250 design has has one less 90 deg turning block but two additional 180 deg turning block transfers. This means that an external system has two 180 deg transfers and the internal boom design has four. The killer block is a 180 turning block low on the mast. It receives the line coming off the 90 deg turndown coming out of the boom and turns it up to the luff tack grommet. If Catanlina had designed the gooseneck to allow that line to be directed up rather than down, the mast turning block would have been eliminated and the internal routing would have worked similar to an external system.

Can the 250 be modified to an external routing to avoid the two additional 180 turning blocks? Sure, the thru the boom routing can be abandoned in favor of external routing for the person who desires single line reefing run to the cockpit. Just add two boom cheek blocks for each reef point. Exactly how this would be done would be dependent on which organizer or side of the mast one would want each reef line to route.

If reefing is done at the mast however, a double line reefing settup is far easier to manage and doesn't require addition of cheek blocks except one for the 2nd reef. Two, easy to handle lines are better than one more difficult to deal with line.

Edited by - on

Steve Milby
Past Commodore

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USA
5897 Posts

Response Posted - 09/14/2004 : 11:18:37

Arlyn, I use a two-line reefing system, but mounted a track with a movable cheek block on the starboard side of the boom, so that the same cheek block can be used for any number of reef points. The reefing line is attached to the mainsail's clew with a reef hook, which can be easily moved from one grommet to another.

Edited by - on

Derek Crawford
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3321 Posts

Response Posted - 09/14/2004 : 11:24:10

Thanks Arlyn for your usual cogent explanation!
Derek

Edited by - on

Arlyn Stewart
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2980 Posts

Response Posted - 09/14/2004 : 12:31:45

Steve,

Your system is an excellent method for the daysailor who often chooses and sets a reef prior to a days outing.

The cruiser on a boat like the 250 will often switch gears a lot while underway and its very helpful to leave the 1st reef set so that the 2nd can simple be released back to the first hence the reason I've not chosen to use a reef hook for the tack. Also, using a reef hook means that the halyard has to be retensioned as part of the reef procedure, whereas a tack line allows the sail to be dropped to a premarked location, and the tack line firmed down and cleated.

Its mostly then a matter of what kind of sailing one is settup for. Another example of this is mast gates. They are fantasic on the slipped or moored boat but jack lines on the lower slugs work much better for the trailer sailor than dealing with mast gates, as long as there is a stopper above the gate

Edited by - on

Keith D.
Navigator

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USA
233 Posts

Response Posted - 09/14/2004 : 22:12:05

Ok Arlyn what are jack lines? How are they attached to the lower slugs? This sounds like the answer to a question I have posted several times of how do you get the forward reefing point down to the boom with all of the lower slugs in the way. I have even added a mast gate which helps with the first reefing point but still doesn’t leave enough room in the track for the second reefing point.

Edited by - on

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