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Catalina/Capri 25/250 Sailor's Forums

Catalina 25 Specific Forum

Tiller Pilot

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mga
1st Mate

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USA
38 Posts

Initially Posted - 07/28/2012 : 19:11:04

I purchased a Raymarine ST1000+ tiller pilot for my 1989 Catalina 25, and would like to hear from those who have installed one on their 25. I am considering a cantilever mount off the cockpit seatback, but that calls for a fairly large bracket hung permanently on the bottom of the tiller, which seems like it would bark your knees when sailing without the pilot. Also considered drilling a one inch deep hole and gluing in a brass socket (provided with the pilot) higher up on the rail top, which then would only need a simple pin glued into the top of the tiller (unit has to end up horizontal). This seems like a good plan, except that I don't know how thick the rail is (more or less than the required 1 inch drill depth for the socket?), and getting a chunk of plywood backer glued in looks nearly impossible with the interior liner in the way. Who has done it, and how did you do it?

Mike Aimone
Belleville, MI
C25 #5856 SR/WK
"Lean Machine"

Edited by - on

awetmore
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1144 Posts

Response Posted - 07/28/2012 : 20:46:59

I installed a ST2000+ about 6 weeks ago. I mounted it 16" or 17" forward from the pintels on the tiller (instead of 18") and used a 5" rod extension. This put the fixed mount along the very back edge of the cockpit seatback. It's out of the way and works great. The center of the mounting pins is 29" apart here (instead of 24" without the extension).

The ST2000+ has a higher torque motor and transmission, so I felt okay "cheating" a little bit by mounting the tiller pilot a little closer to the rudder. Putting it at the right place (18") would have made the tiller pilot mount into a sloped portion of the rail.

I can take a photo tomorrow if that would be helpful.

The rail in the section that I used already had a plywood core and I didn't find it necessary to put on a backer plate. However you can get into that area from the dumpster (my tiller pilot is mounted on the port side since my motor is starboard) if you do want to add the backer board.

My electrical connection is in one of the cubby holes. It is easy to access and protected from the weather.

Edited by - on

hewebb
Admiral

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USA
761 Posts

Response Posted - 07/29/2012 : 03:42:37

I would like t see some photos as this is a future installation for me. Hopefully in the spring before I go to the gulf.

Edited by - on

JeanAndre
Navigator

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USA
224 Posts

Response Posted - 07/29/2012 : 05:41:36

Someone here on the forum has an autopilot installed inside the quarter cabin brought a hole under the cockpit seat that looks really nice, and tried to look for the thread but too many results came on my search it is worth looking for...

Cheers

Edited by - on

mga
1st Mate

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USA
38 Posts

Response Posted - 07/29/2012 : 05:42:01

Thanks for the quick answer, Alex. The port side mount is a good idea, as well as the socket mounted in the coaming compartment. I'd like to see your photos when you get the chance.

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dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 07/29/2012 : 06:59:01

I have a cantilevered mounted autopilot and I only have a 1/2" of pin protruding from the top of the tiller.

[url="http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4536671289105007193#docid=-4057230084458630944"]My autopilot[/url]

[url="http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4536671289105007193"]Autopilot[/url]

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awetmore
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1144 Posts

Response Posted - 07/29/2012 : 17:08:52

Photos here:
http://alexandchristine.smugmug.com/Sailing/Raymarine-ST2000-Installation/24453315_cX4STJ#!i=1994645863&k=pVv3kxP

I forgot to take one without the pilot installed, but you can guess what it might look like. The only things that remain are the pin (which doesn't stick up much) on the tiller and the brass pivot point on the aft starboard rail.

Edited by - awetmore on 07/29/2012 17:12:12

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 07/29/2012 : 18:37:38

Alex,

Is that a replacement rudder?

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awetmore
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1144 Posts

Response Posted - 07/29/2012 : 21:26:23

Yes, it is an IdaSailor/RudderCraft one from Catalina Direct that is made out of HDPE. If you search my old posts you can see my comments on it, I'm not a huge fan.

From the point of view of the tiller pilot it does matter that I have the rudder mounted about 1" too high. That happened because I was being a bit too conservative in my measurements for the pintles, my boat didn't come with a rudder that I could measure from (it was improperly setup with a C-22 rudder). If I had the rudder and tiller 1" lower the pin on the tiller would need to be a little longer to compensate. I don't think it would need to sit a full inch higher, as it is the tiller pilot is tilted slightly up. You can see this if you compare the angle of the pushrod with the back of the transom on my boat.

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mga
1st Mate

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USA
38 Posts

Response Posted - 07/29/2012 : 22:10:40

Don, Alex and all, thanks for the information and the pictures (and great videos). Although my '89 is a bit different than the earlier model shown in the photo, I am choosing to use the top of the rail on the port side for the pivot, and use the portside coaming compartment to mount and protect the cable connector. Seems to be the easiest approach, ends up with the pilot oriented correctly, the least holes drilled, least new parts needed, keeps the motor side (starboard side) clear, and gets the connector out of your seat back. I appreciate all the help and experience this group offers.

Edited by - on

awetmore
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1144 Posts

Response Posted - 07/30/2012 : 07:01:39

It'd be nice to see photos of your installation when done. Based on the hull number I didn't realize that your boat was an '89, it is amazing how quickly production slowed after 1985. I haven't looked closely at how the cockpit layout changed in the later years.

The autopilot has been great for open water sailing.

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 07/30/2012 : 07:35:41

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by mga
 I am choosing to use the top of the rail on the port side for the pivot, and use the portside coaming compartment to mount and protect the cable connector. Seems to be the easiest approach, ends up with the pilot oriented correctly,
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Mike,

With the later model C25's having a taller rudder, mounting it as you described seems like the way to go...Are you a singlehanded sailor?

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mga
1st Mate

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USA
38 Posts

Response Posted - 07/30/2012 : 20:54:28

I should have the installation completed in a day or two, and will try to add some pics here. Answering Don's question, I enjoy sailing with old salts, novices, or alone if nobody is available -- the autopilot should make it a bit easier.

Edited by - on

Stu Jackson C34
Admiral

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844 Posts

Response Posted - 07/30/2012 : 21:12:19

I put ours on the starboard seat with the bracket below. Never got in the way. No extenders need.

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GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4275 Posts

Response Posted - 07/30/2012 : 21:12:40

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by mga
 Don, Alex and all, thanks for the information and the pictures (and great videos). Although my '89 is a bit different than the earlier model shown in the photo, I am choosing to use the top of the rail on the port side for the pivot, and use the portside coaming compartment to mount and protect the cable connector. Seems to be the easiest approach, ends up with the pilot oriented correctly, the least holes drilled, least new parts needed, keeps the motor side (starboard side) clear, and gets the connector out of your seat back. I appreciate all the help and experience this group offers.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Mike,

I'd like to see some pictures when you get done.

BTW... my '89 probably shared the factory with yours being only 6 boats newer than yours!

Edited by - on

mga
1st Mate

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USA
38 Posts

Response Posted - 08/02/2012 : 09:43:51

I ran into a big problem in my installation! The mounting scenario that I chose above calls for a 5 inch rod extension, enabling the simplest and cheapest installation. Prior to drilling the required holes, I checked for availability of the extension, and Raymarine was out of stock. I found a seller on eBay that had 9 in stock, and promised expedited delivery (for a fee). I have now drilled and installed all parts per the instruction manual, and still no rod extender. Then Paypal just sent me a message saying that my order had been cancelled by the seller. I contacted the eBay seller, and he said he tried to locate one, but Raymarine was out of stock! He advertised being in stock, charged 40% over msrp, charged extra for expediting, and had nothing! Raymarine won't have anything in until September, maybe. Anyone out there know of anyone that may have tiller pilot installation parts in stock, or that has changed from a Raymarine pilot to another brand and may have the old one around? Long shot, but I'm held hostage by Raymarine's poor stock management and another eBay shuckster.

Edited by - on

awetmore
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1144 Posts

Response Posted - 08/02/2012 : 09:47:07

I bought my 5" extension from Defender about a month ago. Right now they say "call to check status", so I'd call them.

They list 4" and 1" so you could double those up. A 6" may also work depending on your boat, I think it would have worked for mine.

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dragonf1y
1st Mate

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USA
34 Posts

Response Posted - 08/02/2012 : 09:53:17

Did you do a search in Google Shopping or Bing Shopping, etc? A lot of stores show them out of stock. I found a couple that show it in stock/available. Not sure about this place, but they show it 'available' (assuming this is the piece you're looking for). Whether or not that's accurate is something you'd need to find out for sure. http://www.boatstore.com/raymarine-5in-pushrod-extension-for-tiller-pilots.html

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awetmore
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1144 Posts

Response Posted - 08/02/2012 : 09:56:53

I would call or email to double check. When I was looking for a ST2000+ I found that most places were out of stock on them and everyone that I emailed (5 or 6 stores) who claimed to have it were really drop shipping from Raymarine and did not. I ended up buying the last one from Fisheries Supply (local to Seattle), but they don't stock the pushrods.

Edited by - on

PZell
Admiral

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USA
548 Posts

Response Posted - 08/02/2012 : 10:39:39

Mike, I have the ST-1000 with catalevered mount on starboard side on my '79. When the cantalever is attached the little storage locker cannot open all the way, but it doesn't affect my operation. The pin on top of tiller is no problem. I seem to remember that I didn't need that 5 inch extension and threw it in one of the drawers. I will look next time I'm at the boat, just in case you can't dig one up somewhere else.

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mga
1st Mate

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USA
38 Posts

Response Posted - 08/02/2012 : 12:44:13

After calling Raymarine, Googling and following up on all possibilities -- no rod extensions available until September, including all combinations that add up to 5 inches. Boatstore.com is similar to the rest, relying on Raymarine to stock the stuff. However, Raymarine tech support did a special internal check, and just called me back -- they actually found a 2 and 3 inch piece in a warehouse in Ohio. I'm good to go, if they show up! Thanks for your suggestions.

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awetmore
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1144 Posts

Response Posted - 08/02/2012 : 13:03:22

Did you check with Defender on the 1+4? They do show those in stock, and their in-stock status has generally been accurate for me.
http://www.defender.com/product.jsp?path=-1|344|2028687|2028719&id=1033081

Edited by - awetmore on 08/02/2012 13:04:32

Boomeroo
Navigator

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Australia
128 Posts

Response Posted - 08/07/2012 : 04:07:58

I have my Raymarine in a similar set up to the photo from awetmore except a little further forward .
Extension I made out of standard plastic Electrical conduit which happens to fit exactly over the drive rod . .Painted matt black its been in use for 2 years . Its cut to a length to exactly be in mid position with the tiller straight . $2

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