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Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3704 Posts

Initially Posted - 05/24/2008 : 23:22:39

The Admiral wants heat in the cabin (no wisecracks please

). Anyone have experience with this unit?

Here's the description:

Simplicity and safety, plus a respectable 5,000Btu make this a good non-electric heater. The absorbent material soaks up the alcohol fuel to prevent spills. Remove the lid and use the Heat Pal as a single-burner stove to heat coffee or warm food. Non-pressurized, rustproof, needs no priming or preheating.

* Absorbent material soaks up the alcohol fuel to prevent spills
* Remove the lid and use the Heat Pal as a single-burner stove to heat coffee or warm food
* Non-pressurized, rustproof, needs no priming or preheating; 5,000Btu
* Dimensions 11.5"H x 11.5"D

We cannot direct the winds but we can adjust our sails.

Edited by - on

MartinJW
Navigator

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USA
241 Posts

Response Posted - 05/25/2008 : 00:43:24

This makes me a little nervous. If it's cold enough to use a heater, you'll probably have the cabin reasonably sealed. Any combustion in a confined space is liable to produce poisonous carbon monoxide, maybe lots of carbon monoxide.

I dunno.

Edited by - on

sweetcraft
Admiral

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USA
816 Posts

Response Posted - 05/25/2008 : 00:55:46

Secure unit maybe in the sink? Sneaker waves can upset the pot at a dock or at anchor. I haven't tried this type but a catalytic and the alcohol stove have been used and do they make moisture. The electric has been the best and it dries everything out. I haven't tried the inverter with the third battery for the electric heater but mine would work in a pinch at least for a while.

What I do have to finish installing is the catalytic propane Force 10 which I think will do the job. I am also installing a CO2 detector to be a little more safe. The Force 10 has a chimney with a cap which will exhaust the burned fuel. I plan to never sleep with the heater running. Have you ever thought of a chimney unit? Oh I had been looking for a heater for a long time and I found the Force 10 at a boater's exchange for $40.00 which was kerosene and then I installed a propane Coleman catalytic heater and it fit. (pictures later)

Randy I have faced the same problem and it is only a win if we got shore power. Good luck.

Edited by - on

Steve Blackburn
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
1091 Posts

Response Posted - 05/25/2008 : 01:00:34

Looks like a pretty big unit too, almost 1 foot cube about the size of a basketball.

You could use a heater with ODS (Oxygen Depletion Sensor) which shut down automaticaly if there is not enough oxygen. The ODS heater is designed to be used indoors however the manufacturers suggest shutting it down before going to sleep. I believe if one would use an ODS type heater in conjunction to a CO alarm and leave a window open slightly you should be safe. [url="http://www.shopping.com/xPO-Mr-Heater-MH9B"]Here are a few[/url]. You can also view an interesting evaluation by the U.S. Consumer Product Safety Commission [url="http://www.cpsc.gov/cpscpub/prerel/prhtml03/03021.html"]here[/url].

Edited by - Steve Blackburn on 05/25/2008 01:28:01

Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3704 Posts

Response Posted - 05/25/2008 : 09:26:48

Thanks for the replies!

Steve, that Mr. Heater looks like a better solution. I already carry propane cannisters for the grill.

Jim, your idea is a good one too. I'd have to figure out where to install a unit that had a chimney. It would add an air of "saltiness" to the Nauti Duck!

I already have a CO2 detector in the boat. Lat year in Anacortes we docked next to a boat that just had two crew go to the emergency room after passing out from outboard exhaust that drifted into the cabin. I would never run any unit while we slept.

We do carry a small electric heater that we use when on shore power. I assumed that it is not practical to use such a device on an inverter because it would rapidly drain the battery. True?? For example is it even reasonable to think that this could run off my two Group 24 batteries with combined 160 Amps?? Inverters remain a bit of a mystery to me.

Melt away the morning chill!

This ultra-quiet heater is perfect for boats, homes and offices. Versatility and simplicity with three heat settings—1500W (5200Btu), 900W (3120Btu) and “energy saver” 600W (2080Btu), which draws just 5A. Adjustable thermostat control keeps you comfortable. Antifreeze setting automatically turns on when temperature drops to 38°F. Overheat protector will not clog with dust or dirt.

* Heat Source: AC Electric
* Draw: 5A-13A
* Btu: 5200Btu @ 1500W, 3120Btu @ 900W, 2080Btu @ 600W
* Material: Aluminum & Plastic
* Dimensions: 11 1/4"L x 5"H x 8"D
* Warranty: Five Years

Edited by - on

stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 05/25/2008 : 10:46:54

an electric heater will probably not run off an inverter. For starters, inverters are inefficient, they generate (lose) heat in the energy conversion process. Air conditioning units will not run off inverters. (according to the 12 Volt Bible)
If your electric heater did operate with your inverter, you would run your batteries down very quickly.
I've used a Tent heater (catalytic heater) with good results. runs off propane tanks. I start it in the cockpit, then bring it into the cabin when it has heated up a bit. I usually slide open the top a bit and open the forward hatch a crack for a little cross ventillation.

the admiral really likes these gel bags - click the little metal disk and they heat up and are great for inside a sleeping bag or against your back etc.(I think this is an example of an endothermic reaction) To restore them, you boil them in water for about 15 minutes. Cost anywhere from $6.95 and up depending on size.

Edited by - on

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 05/25/2008 : 12:06:16

We use a [url="http://www.coleman.com/coleman/colemancom/detail.asp?product_id=5036A850&categoryid=28130"]Coleman propane heater designed for heating electric golf carts[/url]. Ours is the older model that doesn't have the nice piezo-electric starter, you have to use a match or lighter to get it going. It fits nicely into the top of our 5-day cooler using a drink holder thingy that attaches to the propane cannister. Light it in the cockpit (not under the sail), and then bring it inside. We also have a CO monitor on the port bulkhead close to the chainplate. I've never seen the CO monitor register any CO. We would never sleep with it on, too many chances for something to go wrong.

I think if I were buying another heater, I'd look into a [url="http://www.amazon.com/Mr-Heater-Portable-Propane-MH9B/dp/B00005LEXI"]Mr. Heater Buddy[/url], it has a low oxygen sensor which I wasn't aware was available when I bought the Coleman.

Stampeder, the little pocket heaters are [url="http://www.saltheater.com/introduction.html"]exothermic salts[/url], they give off heat when catalyzed by the little metallic button to form salt crystals again. The [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exothermic_reaction"]reaction gives off heat[/url].

Edited by - on

GaryB
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4304 Posts

Response Posted - 05/25/2008 : 12:25:57

David,

I bought one of the Mr. Heater Buddy's several years ago when I was going to be doing some camping. I did not like it because it has an open flame (very small but there none the less) and I never could get it to burn with a blue flame like it's supposed to do. Mine may have been defective but I still didn't like the open flame.

Edited by - on

stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 05/25/2008 : 18:56:32

We had a doctor on board last week and when we showed it to her she said it was an endothermic reaction, and my Admiral said it was Exothermic, and then I had another beer because both of them have two more degrees than I do.

Apparently the discussion revolved around where the energy comes from - from the heating to restore the gel state or the re-release of the heat when the metal disc is pushed.

I may have had the lowest IQ on-board, but I was still the captain.

Edited by - on

delliottg
Former Mainsheet C250 Tech Editor

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USA
4479 Posts

Response Posted - 05/25/2008 : 20:02:07

I'd have to agree with the admiral, the reaction causing the salts to crystalize is exothermic (releasing heat), driving the salts back into solution by boiling them is endothermic (requiring heat to occur).

Edited by - on

stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 05/26/2008 : 08:04:10

I thought it was an Ionic reaction, where the Electrons were creating Ionic bonds and releasing heat in the process.

Edited by - on

Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3704 Posts

Response Posted - 05/26/2008 : 09:15:06

I thought it was just some sort of magic.

Edited by - on

stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 05/26/2008 : 12:44:30

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I thought it was just some sort of magic<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Next time we have a scientific debate, I'm going to call you.

*just before the ladies beat me over the head with more examples of how much smarter they are.

Edited by - on

SEAN
Admiral

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USA
772 Posts

Response Posted - 05/26/2008 : 13:53:16

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">I think if I were buying another heater, I'd look into a Mr. Heater Buddy, it has a low oxygen sensor .<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I have one like that , works fine I use it all the time !

Edited by - SEAN on 05/26/2008 13:55:57

britinusa
Web Editor

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USA
5404 Posts

Response Posted - 05/26/2008 : 14:05:31

We have the floor model of the coleman, not the most stable unit. That Mr. Buddy looks just the ticket!

Nice cabin Sean!

Paul

Edited by - on

Steve Blackburn
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
1091 Posts

Response Posted - 05/26/2008 : 14:16:28

Sean do you also have a Carbon Monoxide alarm? (not on the unit itself, seperate mounted somewhere else in the boat). Do you need to leave a window open or something?

BTW: Nice galley setup.

Edited by - on

johnsonp
Admiral

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USA
606 Posts

Response Posted - 05/26/2008 : 14:17:51

http://www.ventedcatheater.com/6.html

Edited by - on

Prospector
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
3159 Posts

Response Posted - 05/26/2008 : 14:34:04

Ebay find... not sure if its worth it.

[url="http://cgi.ebay.ca/Force-10-Marine-Cabin-Heater-Stove-Kerosene-Diesel_W0QQitemZ320254666576QQihZ011QQcategoryZ124106QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem"]Ebay Heater[/url]

Edited by - on

SEAN
Admiral

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USA
772 Posts

Response Posted - 05/26/2008 : 15:40:34

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Sean do you also have a Carbon Monoxide alarm?
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Steve ,

I know I should but I dont .

I keep the companionway open or if its cold slide it back .

Edited by - on

stampeder
Master Marine Consultant

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1608 Posts

Response Posted - 05/26/2008 : 16:45:43

Zodi makes these outdoor heaters - the unit sits outside, and you vent in the heated air. Similar to the Zodi hot water heaters as discussed in another thread.

Edited by - on

ClamBeach
Master Marine Consultant

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3072 Posts

Response Posted - 05/26/2008 : 18:04:48

I have a Mr. Heat Buddy too and it works fine. It has auto low-O2 shutoff... but I certainly wouldn't take a nap with it running. A CO Detector would be good investment.

Symptoms of CO poisoning:

Headache
Fatigue
Shortness of breath
Nausea
Dizziness

I know some people that were poisoned at a potluck by a charcoal barbeque burning under a semi-enclosed porch. Main symptoms reported... severe headache followed by dizziness. Nobody was killed but one guy (who had a heart condition) ended up in the hospital.

Edited by - on

DaveR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2015 Posts

Response Posted - 05/27/2008 : 09:46:47

I'd bring my 1000 watt Honda generator (extremely quiet), put it down wind, have the appropriate detectors and use an electric.

Edited by - on

Nautiduck
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
3704 Posts

Response Posted - 05/27/2008 : 12:52:10

Dave, the Honda generator is a nice idea. I think I'll go the lower cost route, though. A local sporting goods store has the Mr. Buddy on sale for $69.

Your Honda idea made me recall something. When we were shopping for a 250 we looked at one at our lake. This guy had a generator (loud, not a Honda) and a long extension cord. He would put the generator in the dink and have it float off with the long outdoor extension cord running to the boat!

Edited by - Nautiduck on 05/27/2008 12:53:50

redviking
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1771 Posts

Response Posted - 05/27/2008 : 14:15:13

When cruising on our c25, we would take our portable generator and float it in the dink. Took the vibration and noise away from the boat.

Our little propane heater burned a bottle in 5 hours of use and we loved it. Comfort is what separates cruisers from day sailors. Getting warm and drying out after a storm, changes the experience from a negative one to one wherein the negative aspects of being cold and wet are quickly replaced and forgotten.

As far as oxygen supply goes, crack the v-berth hatch for ventilation if required. We never had our CO detector go off during several years of use. But we did fog up the windows drying stuff out.

Another trick that some cruisers use is an inverted pot over the stove with a fan blowing gently on it. Beats being cold.

sten

Edited by - on

DaveR
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2015 Posts

Response Posted - 05/27/2008 : 14:40:41

I didn't think about the vibration!!! It may be quiet and it's even on rubber but I'll bet I'd be sending it off on the dink before long! You definitely want quiet and if all you do is crack the forward hatch a little I'm with Mr. heater Buddy too. Like that inverted pot thing in a pinch too Sten.

Edited by - on

Prospector
Master Marine Consultant

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Canada
3159 Posts

Response Posted - 05/27/2008 : 15:29:54

I was going to suggest the inverted pot until I did a little research - apparently there are many naysayers abou tth emethod, although some friends of mine swear by it.

Incidentally it is supposed to be a clay flowerpot for those of you not familiar with the trick.

Edited by - on

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