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clayC
Navigator

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USA
207 Posts

Initially Posted - 07/01/2004 : 17:25:47

I should close a deal on a 1982 Catalina 25 this weekend. As soon as I have the hull # I plan to join. my Question is What is the kind of eletronic stuf do I need. (radio, gps, ect.)I will be mostly on lakes here in utah but plan to head to the west coast once in a while and probably Baja.

Thanks Clay

Kamalla 1980 C25 SK/TR

Edited by - on

oldsalt
Admiral

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USA
578 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 17:49:16

You'll get plenty of advice on this one but I'll go first:

VHF radio
Depth finder
Knot meter
Handheld GPS
Automatic battery charger

That's the minimum stuff I think you should have aboard.

Welcome to the C 25 world, I think you'll enjoy your boat.

Edited by - on

RichardG
Admiral

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USA
990 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 18:36:02

VHF radio and basic, handheld GPS would be on my minimum electronics list. Next (but not mandatory) would be a tillerpilot. A Depth/Fishfinder would be nice, although I don't have one installed. Speed (over ground) info can be obtained from my GPS.

You'll most likely need a method to recharge the onboard battery, but there are several ways to skin that cat depending on where and how you keep the boat when not sailing.

While not "needed", a radio/cd player is pretty important to me. I have a boombox which plugs into the cigarette lighter plug.

Edited by - on

sailgal
Captain

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USA
400 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 18:42:46

I'd have to agree with oldsalts list. For me a depth finder on the west coast of Florida is a must have, as well as a vhf for bridge tenders along the ICW. Can't say I use my GPS much, but nice to call on when needed on occasion...also like the built in knot meter on my GPS unit. After 2 and 1/2 years I just added a on board battery charger. The motors alternator has done an incredible job, but overnighting is starting to draw alot more juice hence the need for a charger. You must look at your own needs and weigh out what you feel you'll need. Handheld gps and vhf may be perfect for you as well. Good luck!

Edited by - on

Gloss
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1916 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 19:20:00

With more electronics you will also have to plan on more circuits and wiring. Adding more 12 volt outlets was one thing that I did to plug in my handheld chartplotter, recharge the cell phone, plug in the blender.
I hard wired my VHF, depthsounder, knotmeter, CD player.
Since I sail in the Keys each year I wanted a good strong VHF signal so I have a mast mounted VHF radio with a signal splitter to have very good FM reception.

Edited by - on

clayC
Navigator

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USA
207 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 21:22:29

thanks for the responce. hand held or mounted VHF? i have seen fish finders with GPS and where would the screen be mounted?

Thanks Again
Clay

Edited by - on

frogger
Navigator

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USA
184 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 21:23:17

I would recommend a depth finder, handheld GPS, (I have the Garmin MAPS 76C and it works like a charm.), a solar panel for recharging, dual batteries, spotlight, and VHF radio (don't have yet). I sail a 250 WK on a lake and the depth finder is a necessity.

Edited by - on

Oscar
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2030 Posts

Response Posted - 07/01/2004 : 21:28:18

We went all around the Chesapeake and sailed Florida Coastal Waters with a chart and handheld VHF a handheld GPS and a simple depth sounder. (And a large pack of AA batteries from the discount house of worship...) Total cost (not including batteries) $450.- Simple but reliable, and you can take it with you when you abandon ship.

Oscar
Catalina 42 # 76, Lady Kay
Catalina 250WB#618 Currently FOR SALE:
http:www.woodenshoemusic.com/C250WB

Edited by - Oscar on 07/01/2004 21:29:30

Brooke Willson
Admiral

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USA
983 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2004 : 05:38:43

So, the answer is . . . it depends where you sail. If you're on a lake where you're never out of sight of land, a GPS is less important. If you're always in deep water (no pun intended) and running aground isn't likely, a depth finder is not as important. If you're never more than a few miles from other sailors or a land station, you can get by with a handheld VHF.

I sail on the Chesapeake. It is frequently shallow, so a depth finder is crucial. I am sometimes twenty or thirty miles from a Coast Guard station, so having a VHF antenna on the mast could be a matter of life and death. My handheld GPS has been wonderful for long trips, or for just knowing how fast (or slow) I'm going.

I am a big believer in tillerpilots, especially if you intend to singlehand.

It just depends.

Brooke

Edited by - Brooke Willson on 07/02/2004 05:41:22

sdaly66
Navigator

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USA
143 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2004 : 08:22:16

I also sail the Chespaeake and have many of the same challenges as Brooke. I don't have depth finder, but my 250 WK board swings up nicely on the few occassions when I've hit bottom

. I back up my mast-antenna VHF with a hndheld that I keep on my belt at all times. I have a mapping GPS with chart chip for the bay, and it's very helpful on unfamiliar shoals.

If you are single handing, ALWAYS wear a life vest (SOSpenders are good and stay out of your way. As Brooke said, a tiller tamer or tiller pilot is critical, and a boom topping lift (just got one installed 2 weeks ago) makes sail management MUCH easier when alone.

Good luck!

Edited by - on

Brooke Willson
Admiral

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USA
983 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2004 : 09:37:18

Wow, Shawn, you have an electronic boom topping lift? I am really impressed!

Brooke

Edited by - Brooke Willson on 07/02/2004 09:39:25

clayC
Navigator

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USA
207 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2004 : 11:28:49

thank you all so much..I think i will need (Or at least want) a mast mounted VHF. but what about depth finder. Can I get wireless? GPS? any models that have worked.

thans again
ClayC

Edited by - on

sdaly66
Navigator

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USA
143 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2004 : 11:35:23

Brooke, not only that, I have a neural interface - so all I have to do is THINK IT and it happens. Works better than the previous voice-command model, particularly in heavy wind.

Clay, don't know squat about depth finders and what works or doesn't.

Edited by - on

RichardG
Admiral

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USA
990 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2004 : 12:09:32

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">GPS? any models that have worked<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

As to the question, "any models that haven't worked", I can't think of any because they all provide the same basic piece of important information -- where you are on the earth's surface and how to get where you want to go. You can spend more to get extra bells and whistles, such as on-screen mapping, larger screen, etc., but at a significant jump in price. I use a basic, inexpensive Garmin eTrex in conjunction with paper charts.

Edited by - on

OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2004 : 12:50:37

I can just hear all the old sailing souls in heaven mocking this thread

.

Marketing term: Creation of Demand - creating demand for something that completely didn't exist before.

Can you tell? I'm a purist and enjoy the simple life when it comes to sailing. Okay, so I don't carry wood onboard to send smoke signals

Edited by - OJ on 07/02/2004 22:11:36

sdaly66
Navigator

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USA
143 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2004 : 12:58:03

You're right OJ, some people just go totally overboard on gadgetry. Why just yesterday, I can't tell you how many sailboats I saw with these white propellers mounted to their davits to make them go when the wind is calm - unbelieveable.

Edited by - on

dlucier
Master Marine Consultant

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Virgin Islands (United Kingdom)
7583 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2004 : 13:05:07

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by OJ
 I can just hear all the old sailing souls in heaven mocking us thread

...Can you tell? I'm a purist and enjoy the simple life when it comes to sailing...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I'm a somewhat of a purist too. My last boat, also a 25 footer, didn't have VHF, depth sounder, autopilot, knotmeter, GPS, shorepower,...only a boombox to play some Jimmy Buffett tunes.

Edited by - on

Oscar
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
2030 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2004 : 14:24:55

Clay, re depth sounder go here:

http://www.catalina25-250.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=5894&SearchTerms=depth,sounder

Oscar
Catalina 42 # 76, Lady Kay
Catalina 250WB#618 Currently FOR SALE:
http:www.woodenshoemusic.com/C250WB

Edited by - Oscar on 07/02/2004 14:25:47

Frank Hopper
Past Commodore

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Pitcairn Island
6776 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2004 : 14:37:29

Mast mounted anything requires wiring. Wouldn't a VHF whip on the stern rail be ok?

Edited by - on

cathluk
Admiral

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USA
513 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2004 : 14:48:39

Congrats Clay!

I'll throw my 2 cents in. You've got some great advise so far &, like Brooke said, it really depends where you want to sail. If the Utah lakes are small & deep you don't need much except a handheld VHF (assuming someone is listening). If you plan to sail Baja or the coast I'd upgrade to a masthead VHF, a GPS (how complex is up to you - we started with a Magellan 90 & now have a GPS176C chartplotter which is nice luxury), & a depthfinder or fishfinder (good for finding shallows & following contours for navagation). If you race you'll want a knotmeter, but we do fine w/ the GPS telling us how fast we're going. A autopilot is nice, but unless you singlehand a lot or make long passages I wouldn't consider it a necessity.

I'd also recommend an inflatable life jacket (SOSpenders or similar). You'll be more likely to wear it if its comfortable.

Edited by - on

jwilliams
Captain

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USA
357 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2004 : 15:48:29

Clay,

Your basic electronic assembly of goodies should begin with a set of charts for where you will sail, a compass, and simple charting tools...and the knowledge of how to use them. (USCG Auxiliary courses are free, you buy the books $80).

Guarantee: YOUR ELECTROICS WILL FAIL. You just don't know when. Batteries die, forgot to bring new ones. Wires short, get fouled. Sensors corrode. The sattelite won't connect. These things will happen, sometimes all at once. There was a thing when I was an engineer for NASA we called Most Catastrophic Failure Syndrome...when something went on the fritz it always took something else with it, and that took something else, etc. Even with redundant systems. Apollo 13 was an example.

Except for a VHF radio, electonics are a convenience, not a necessity.

I sail on SF Bay, never outside sight of land, but my charts and compass tools are there if I need them. Fog rolls in and my GPS conks out. I can still estimate my location on the chart and plot a time-distance-bearing course that will get me near enough a sounding Aid to Navigation, whistle, bell, horn, from which I can plot my way home. Brother, let me tell you there ain't nothing more lonely and pucker-factoring than being in the East/West container ship lanes in SF Bay in a dense fog and the wind is doing 20kts.! Those 900ft suckers enter and exit at 10-15kts and you don't show up on radar! So, I want to be well clear of the lanes. My Buddy Paul, keeps a log and often a plot on his C25 Sparky.

Well, you may ask, "I don't intend to be in the situation that could be dangerous or allow my electronics to crap out." (That's like General Wesley Clark's claim that if we elected him president no terrorists would attack America.) Duh.

I will now relinquish my soapbox to my esteemed association fellows. Just get the darned charts and stuff, willyahuh?

Jim Williams
Hey Jude C25fk 2958

ps: My Buddy Paul and me are going to take the USCG Advanced Coastal Nav course again this fall as a refresher.

Edited by - on

RichardG
Admiral

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USA
990 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2004 : 18:19:12

Lots of good ideas...

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Simple but reliable, and you can take it with you when you abandon ship<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
I like that idea also. My GPS, handheld VHF (which I won as a doorprize and serves as a backup to the hardwired one w/ longer range masthead antenae) and cd boombox run on either alkaline batteries or the onboard 12v system through the cigarette lighter plug.

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">should begin with a set of charts for where you will sail, a compass, and simple charting tools...and the knowledge of how to use them...USCG Auxiliary courses are free<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Great point! About 15 years ago (about 8 years before owning a boat), I took a couple USCG navigation courses, but I've probably forgot some of the skills because I rely on my GPS too much (because it's so easy). A refresher course would be good (and fun).

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">East/West container ship lanes in SF Bay in a dense fog...and you don't show up on radar! <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Although our shipping lanes are North/South, a radar reflector is pretty standard equipment around here.

Regarding tiller pilots, while certainly not required, they are often quoted as being the single most appreciated piece of electronics to owners who have installed them. I have to say that I agree -- mine is pretty darn handy.

Edited by - RichardG on 07/02/2004 18:24:22

Todd Frye
Navigator

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USA
222 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2004 : 18:55:30

Clay,
I am on Utah Lake if you would like to have a look at my C-25, SK, SR. I don't use a depth finder because my swing keel does that job for me, but I really like my GPS for night sailing...it keeps me from running into the jetties that extend out into the lake. The autopilot frees up hands so I can easily trim sails. The C.D. player/radio is for social events ...like tomorrow night we will avoid the crowds and watch the Stadium of Fire from out on the lake with friends. A solar panel keeps up with those three units if there is full sun. A handheld VHF has been nice to get the park rangers out on the lake to tow in power boaters that have gassed out. Fair winds. Todd Frye

Edited by - on

Brooke Willson
Admiral

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USA
983 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2004 : 19:35:26

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Can you tell? I'm a purist and enjoy the simple life when it comes to sailing.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Cool! That wooden hulled C25 with the pine mast, cotton sails, and flax rigging is sure impressive! What do you do with the horse you rode to the dock while you're sailing?

It's not whether we're going to use technology -- even a wooden hull is technology. It's just what technology we're going to use. I would highly recommend, if nothing else, a good VHF with an antenna on the mast. A handheld VHF has 5 watts transmitting power: a permanent mount has 25 watts. You want the antenna as high as possible: VHF signals are line of sight.

Today while sailing I listened to Coast Guard Group Eastern Shore (VA) rescuing a boater who had contacted them via VHF. A good radio, literally, could be a matter of life and death.

Brooke

Edited by - on

OJ
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
4382 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2004 : 20:17:59

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Brooke Willson
 <blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Can you tell? I'm a purist and enjoy the simple life when it comes to sailing.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Cool! That wooden hulled C25 with the pine mast, cotton sails, and flax rigging is sure impressive! What do you do with the horse you rode to the dock while you're sailing?

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Horse? heck, my wooden club doubles as the tiller and my spear as the whisker pole

!

Agreed, geographic location dictates need. I'm on an inland lake 98% of the time. I've shared with some here my intention to relocate to the Chesapeake area in the near future; I'm sure I'll be investing in some additional gadgetry then

Edited by - OJ on 07/02/2004 22:12:51

Gloss
Master Marine Consultant

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USA
1916 Posts

Response Posted - 07/02/2004 : 21:32:06

to me, sailing is all about fun.

Messing around with electronics is fun, sailing is fun, listening to tunes is fun, having a backup radio like I do makes me comfortable so i can have more fun. My chartplotter is fun. Reading and plotting on paper charts is fun.

If having no electronics is fun to you, have fun with it.

What is no fun, is when someone will make fun of the decisions you have made to increase your personal fun

Edited by - on

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